Sister without the hood
My Sister & I simply can't get along:( She is 57 & I'm 54 years & this will sound childish. Sorry.
So much over the years I feel I've endured from her. Cheating on her husband with married men, promiscuity & flirting with strangers, AA, Lying/Exaggerating/Story telling. All men want her. Acting Holier than thou. Boho/Wild Spirit Woman/Love & Light/Retreats. Bad Mother. Sobbing phone calls all hours. Judgment! Opinions! Advice! Unasked for given to me! Criticism of my daughter. Criticism of me as a person.
Copying...my hair, my fashion, my likes on FB, my cookery (stealing recipes & calling them her invention) etc. I painted kitchen pin so she painted hers pink. I named my dog Angel so she named her dog Angel. Her depression that leaves her unable to work.
Story telling about herself, our childhood with large exaggerations & fantasy like add ons always painting herself the victim or hero. NEVER TO BLAME. She has been innocent in every break up. Accused my dead Grandfather (dearly popular & loved man to all) of incestual thoughts about her.
Of course she is not to blame. The man is dead & can't defend his honour. I hate her for this! I've endured trips to the cemetery where she sat on the grass atop of his resting place, lit a candle & set his Spirit free. 8 years later he is still guilty & too blame according to her.
Estranged once for 18 months. Can't seem to get our act together as adults. Weren't good as kids. So this evening I'm left seething!
Past fortnight (after me maintaining & keeping my distance for weeks) she made FB contact. Crying. Bawling loudly. Over the top. Thought somebody must have surely died.
I endured her loss of Olivia Newton John, her loss of the Queen (like she knew them personally & making alter tributes as well as facebook tributes to them.
I endured her news that her 21yr old son is Autistic & how she'll never be rid of him as he can't cope alone (I knew he wasn't right from a baby of 8 months old as he didn't follow his milestones (she drank 2 bottles of champagne a night & smoked pot hoping to induce a miscarriage). Ranting over & over of course she is not EVER to blame.
another teary phone call to say that her & the latest man seem to be on the rocks. It isn't her fault. He suddenly turned mean after 18 months of wonderful. This same day she put a photo of them on FB & caption 'my love, my life, my soul mate, my prince charming, I found him at last'. Then told me they are SECRETLY engaged. Had a secret/private ceremony they celebrated just the two of them. A type of hand fastening. She sent photos of the ring he gave her. Mum saw picks & said 'bullshit! that is my old engagement ring she asked if she could have it a year ago & she's had it altered, put it in a little box & told everybody he gave it to her with a promise of forever'. Also, how he is the boss of a big firm. Now he was a trader & just got laid off? Then he was a foreman who quit. I just don't know the truth EVER. Then they went halves in a house. Then she bought them a house & he will pay her off his half bit by bit. Then that changed to he can't afford to pay any so she's copping all the expenses.
I was begged to sit up on the phone (babysit her) while her 25yr old made the non stop 14 hour plane flight to Canada (just incase the plane went down or something PLEASE). I foolishly did it. Left myself exhausted. More to that story! Then sobbing when I pick up the phone 'Her Daughter has covid19 is beside herself alone in Canada says she is dying & scared apparently begging for help'. Criend & carried on for 2 hours at me until I said I had to go to pee & sleep. Then ANGER I wouldn't let her talk to me facetime while I watched the Queens funeral for its 4 hour duration. She is still calling me SELFISH because I said 'no'. There has been so much more but this is just the last 10 days coping with her.
Sorry there is so much more!
Today within 9 seconds of me going on FB to talk to my friends she was sending long PM's about her life.
I ignore & did not respond. Her PM's started to get angry like 'I know you're there & why aren't you responding?'
I told her sorry I'm not in a good mood & need to be left to my own thoughts today.
She pressed & pressed. But why? I want to tell you how I won a poetry competition. Mine was the best in the USA. She lives in Australia.
I tried (attempted to) after she'd regaled me with her daily life story tell her about my bad new neighbours & how the fellow tried to run
me over with his car when I was on the footpath having just collected my mail. How his kids were banging my front door on purpose & laughing encouraged by their parents to do so.
She interrupted with a tirade...
I deserve exactly what I'm getting out of life. I can't expect any better. I haven't worked in the last few years (nor has she but mine is medical) so I don't deserve a house or nice things. She won't listen to my problems as I haven't earnt anything nice in life...it went on.
I was excessively shocked by her words & hurt. I still am. She said I should try to be more like her love & light, positive & hard working???
I told her she hasn't worked in years claiming depression & that her money came from her divorce settlement.
She said she'd worked for every penny. That I do nothing! (I own an online store due to my disability/health issues) so I've literally attracted to me what I deserve. If only I'd leave my dark & dank ways to come over to her light. Then once again knocked me as a person, my personality, my daughter & so forth.
Yes...I lost my temper BIG TIME AT HER. I told her to f-off. I wasn't nice. I confess I tore shreds off her. She unfriended & blocked me.
It is a relief! But her words linger & have stung. She has 68 followers & I have three. She called me unlikable & much more.
Apologies for the wait - everyone's obviously busy in RL.
First, I'm going to list (with slight edits and tidy ups, and additions in caps and double brackets), all the words and sentances that jumped out at me, so bear with me...
(My Sister & I) SIMPLY CAN'T get along:(
THIS WILL SOUND CHILDISH
So much over the years...I've endured from her ((I took out 'I feel' because this isn't just your perception or point of view, these are historical facts and events))
on her husband
with married men,
promiscuity & flirting
Lying/Exaggerating/Story telling. ((E.G.)) All men want her.
Acting Holier than thou.
(Boho/Wild Spirit Woman/Love & Light/Retreats.) = ((IN CONTEXT OF HER PERVASIVELY SERIOUSLY-OFF-KILTER ATTITUDES = PRETENTIOUS))
Sobbing phone calls
Judgment! Opinions! Advice! Unasked for given to me!
of my daughter.
...of me as a person.
Copying...my hair, my fashion, my likes on FB, my cookery
recipes & calling them her invention) etc. I painted kitchen pin so she painted hers pink. I named my dog Angel so she named her dog Angel.
Her depression that leaves her unable to work.
Well, so far, there's not much of her seriously-concerning behaviour I can LEAVE OUT! Already it is as obvious as the nose on my face, that your sister is pettily narcissistic (a Benign Narcissist).
She displays every...single...major symptomatic character trait. In fact, it's closer to the truth from, what I can see, to say, she *IS* NARCISSISM - that's how rife her unhealthily narcissistic behavour and habits, both over- and under-the-table, ARE. (Fyi, all humans have narcissism, which at the right 'dose', is vital and healthy...butut it's about DEGREES and pervasive patterns of. Theirs can be so disturbingly overblown that it makes interpersonal harmony, bonding and thriving, IMPOSSIBLE (as you well-know from all these years of this non-stop dysfuntion on her part).
"Runaway Train Wreck" is also what springs to mind. She can't stop repeatedly ploughing ahead, regardless, and ("what a surprise, same as last time") crashing. So she also sounds Histrionic PD.
(Cleveland Clinic: "Histrionic personality disorder (HPD) is a mental health condition marked by unstable emotions, a distorted self-image and an overwhelming desire to be noticed. People with HPD often behave dramatically or inappropriately to get attention."
She's not adult-functional, is she. She's not even late-teenager-functional. She's like trying to nail jelly to the ceiling. Especially as it's patently evident that she doesn't learn and hasn't even grown-out of what are a lot of childish (negative) ways. So at this point - because Malignant Narcissists, the next level up from Benign, CANNOT LEARN, EVEN FROM EXPERIENCE - I have to change my opinion to Malignant (sorry). Either that or she's on the verge - REALLY FULL-ON Benign.
Some improve with age, while some get worse...and the fact you've finally cracked, indicates that she's the latter and that your 'bucket hath overfloweth', aided by the fact of her age/maturity being only on-paper, definitely not in her head. She's definitely Stunted aka developmentally arrested.
What happened, in your opinion, that you can think of, turned her that way (obviously when still a child)?
But let's just continue listing all the visible and palpable symptoms:
"Story telling...with large exaggerations & fantasy like add ons
always painting herself the victim or hero.
NEVER TO BLAME.
She has been innocent in every break up.
Accused my dead Grandfather (dearly popular & loved man to all) of incestual thoughts about her.
Of course she is not to blame. The man is dead & can't defend his honour. I hate her for this! I've endured trips to the cemetery where she sat on the grass atop of his resting place, lit a candle & set his Spirit free. 8 years later he is still guilty & too blame according to her."
Right. Although she's not dealing with it the way a normal-healthy person would - could it be true that your grandfather was the "mother ship"? And, YES he's dead. But then that's what would make it finally safe to be more vocal and less vague about it all for her. Look what happened once Jimmy Saville died - right? Loads of victims felt it safe to finally "come out". I'm sure the rest were in no fit state, still, to articulate it openly and clearly - just STRAIGHT.
I mean, it's obvious to me that you've already compared her online with the copious lists and explanations about NPD now out there. But what you won't have studied yet is how some Narcissistic Abusers can be wonderful and admired and loved by all in public and even their families, while secretly, behind-closed-doors, showing their truer, darker nature to i.e. picking on, just one member of their family. Usually one that isn't watched and monitored enough...always playing solitary in their own little world, perhaps "the difficult child". That way, the victim's attempted accusations fall on deaf ears: "Hhh!, how could you say such a thing - he's lovely, everyone says so! You must be making it up!" - which compounds the victim's sense of powerless and helplessness and just adds to the trauma (and also makes the "Flying Monkeys" (google) feel very stupid and ashamed once the truth comes out...which it always, always, somehow does. But if that IS his case (usually, him re-enacting what was done to him as a child), then what she's been inflicted and infected with is Malignant NPD.
Please just open your mind, re-watch all the memory tapes in your head, and consider it seriously and fairly (even if - in fact, especially if perhaps it appeared she was always his favourite) - and then report back your thoughts. (PS "Favourites" doesn't happen in healthy families.)
"Estranged once for 18 months. Can't seem to get our act together as adults. Weren't good as kids. So this evening I'm left seething!
Past fortnight (after me maintaining & keeping my distance for weeks) she made FB contact. Crying. Bawling loudly. Over the top. Thought somebody must have surely died."
So evidently, tears work on you, then. Although I get she made out it was serious enough to put all grudges aside. Again - common tactic to break your No Contact. Another typical one is "I've got cancer", when, truth is they haven't even seen a doctor yet.
"I endured her loss of Olivia Newton John, her loss of the Queen (like she knew them personally & making alter tributes as well as facebook tributes to them."
HAHAHAHAHAH!!! Although, it's only funny the first time, I get that.
Well, anyway, she's a Vulnerable. But not a Covert (unless the surface nonsense is a constant smoke-screen for something(s) more nefarious?)
She adopts whatever gains her attention, sympathy...basically makes her Special (without having to work for it)-
I endured her news that her 21yr old son is Autistic & how she'll never be rid of him as he can't cope alone (I knew he wasn't right from a baby of 8 months old as he didn't follow his milestones (she drank 2 bottles of champagne a night & smoked pot hoping to induce a miscarriage). Ranting over & over of course she is not EVER to blame."
'Rid of him'. And she meant it because even before that point she'd tried to abort him. Right. That's nice. (And, champagne, noted.) But - normal for (brace-brace-brace!) Sociopathic, abnormal, "mothers". They might have lots of kids but the kids are more hooks (so the ASD can't just up and leave them), collateral, leverage and insurance, triangulation aids...etc. Alternatively, a male spath can overladen his wife with kids...knackered etc. equals she's easier to control - and this is why you have to judge the entire table of evidence, not any one symptom or incident/event in isolation - or the subtleties, grey areas and, THEREIN, "in-betweenies", will tie your brain in knots. (I suspect that's what the Twister game was unwittingly based on - because it's due to close-up, in-person social interacting that leaves you tied, possibly painfully but certainly uncomfortably and destabilizingly, bodily in knots and/or to the other people on the board.)
Ok, she's a Spath Narc (low level) - jury's in, thanks to that biggie. But I guess that tallies anyway with her attempts through aimed manipulation to CONTROL you and your decisions (e.g. to keep zero contact), choices, etc. Benigns don't tend to be trying to control you, "just" wear you down to where they feel taller as well as better for having puked their latest, self-generated toxins all over you (by being verbally nasty and negative).
You've kept a lot in, for a very long time, haven't you?) (Not a criticism - the longer and more detailed the post, the better/easier. Just noting.
Could be her child's father was a (high-functional?) Autistic/Aspergic, which are the type that are (only SEEM, actually) the tastiest Narc Num-Nums to your narcissists of every level, for being (SEEMING) very well-meaning, giving, trusting, (SEEMINGLY) without the defense package to match. (I say seeming because if they're neurotypified (by self or others), these are the types that, once they reach their extra long end-of-tether, can paste the walls with Narcs, NO PROB LE MO! High-Functioning Aspies/Autistics are the literal opposite of Narcissists and, despite locked-in until freed, far more lethal (known as The Narcissist's Worst Nightmare). Aspies tend to LACK narcissism or not bother or fail to 'remember' to use it (they can SENSE their above-average mental strength and capacity potential), if you like. ...Until they do. They have to be pushed harder and farther before blowing their tops but when they do, IT'S BIGGER. (Being capable of taking on a Narc is mainly because they have no social fear and are obssessive/laser-beam focused like a Psycho, but with more staying power AND hidden, mental agility whereby they can keep a number of facts and details "up in the air", 'visibily' in front of them, simultaneously, whereby they don't forget to include anything in any of their retorts and responses - "Yes, you DID say that!"...proceeded by describing in details where they were standing at the time, what they were wearing, what day of what month it was... No Filters (to whatever degree) equals NOTHING or TOO LITTLE missed and not registered. The higher-functionals make superb barristers.) Narcs rarely get one over on any adult HF Aspies/Autistics.
"then...another teary phone call to say that her & the latest man seem to be on the rocks. It isn't her fault. He suddenly turned mean after 18 months of wonderful."
Well, it's possible he could have, actually, because: 18 months before removing his mask is a typical time-frame for a Narcisstic Sociopath (AsPD), and a Benign (or what might PRESENT as one) - their seeming "inferior" - is the SECOND tastiest num-nums. Reason being, "mere" Narcs believe they're not susceptible to BEING manipulated, which is because 99% of Healthy-Normals (their victim type) are normally Too Polite (particularly when too stunned to know what to do except fall back on the sociability-habits 'handrail')...like YOU did due to her hammed-up "distress" and hysterical noises as made you revert to the social conduct rule of HAVING to pick up in any emergency. (See that bit?) Plus Normals haven't tended to need to have had any PRACTISE at manipulating so aren't normally clever and convincing
enough with it. Benigns are therefore pretty defenseless against BEING manipulated or spotting it coming at or working on them (until it's too late).
Right now, in my RL, I'm busy watching (once-removed) exactly that: a Benign female Narc, unwittingly in the clutches of a female malignant-narc Sociopath, who is actively attempting (starting to succeed, actually) to socially isolate her, destroy her support network, which is a sign she's about to begin going in for the kill (we reckon, her money, through luring away her husband...but then it usually is money or assets with Spaths - as well as slowly siphoning off your personality and killing your great qualities, of course).
So let's, for-now, no longer concern ourselves with that level of depth and just focus on the fact that you know what she is, and she's bad for you, which you know as well. End Of. So you've tried to cut contact but she managed to Narcissistically Hoover you (and scraped the barrel to do so). That's the first and most urgent issue to be tackled, right there.
I'll finish up, though...
" This same day she put a photo of them on FB & caption 'my love, my life, my soul mate, my prince charming, I found him at last'. Then told me they are SECRETLY engaged. Had a secret/private ceremony they celebrated just the two of them."
That shows he fake Dismissed her to scare her into agreeing to get engaged (or he wouldn't come back). And that she grabbed it like a lifeline...or a pardon. So we know what HE is, then, don't we. Because what genuine man that genuinely is DONE (thus chucks) his girlfriend, 5 minutes later agrees to get ENGAGED to her. What a crock. What a stronarm-ing tactic. And what a state of utter desperation (addiction) he's got her into. Benign Narc or not - she doesn't deserve the battering HE'S been giving her and will continue giving.
I can see that your sister's genuinely in trouble. And that this MIGHT be a case (which doesn't take away from her own stupidity and self-sabotaging) of 'the little shepherd now crying Wolf! for real'?
(...Starting to wonder if she might actually be Borderline PD (over-bullied for over-long) but with reactive npd?)
No adult that doesn't know what they're doing, can handle a Spath, or even know that's what they've got on their poor hands. This changes things. She'll badly need your strength and support in the not too distant future. Maybe this shock plus the very next psychological battering he gives her, will prove to be the point where she gets real and starts listening and taking your advice (whilst on as best behaviour as she's capable of)?
You need more data because, to be fair and balanced about this - you don't KNOW it was he who broke it off. You only know what SHE told you.
"...A type of hand fastening. She sent photos of the ring he gave her. Mum saw picks & said 'bullshit! that is my old engagement ring she asked if she could have it a year ago & she's had it altered, put it in a little box & told everybody he gave it to her with a promise of forever'. Also, how he is the boss of a big firm. Now he was a trader & just got laid off? Then he was a foreman who quit. I just don't know the truth EVER. Then they went halves in a house.
Then she bought them a house & he will pay her off his half bit by bit. Then that changed to he can't afford to pay any so she's copping all the expenses."
He's a Spath alright. That last two-part sentance proves it beyond any doubt...such a common 'old chestnut'. (I guess they're picking on their own kind now that everyone's had their eyes opened to them and are now in dire financial circumstances?...losing their homes?) But - whoops- losing their job (if they even had one and weren't lying), whereby the woman then 'has' to support him (her special person (not)) by providing his month-to-month living....which then never ends. Until a crisis like this one where the woman no longer has a choice because she simply cannot afford him any more...out he goes....unless she's still highly addicted so caves.
She, on the other hand, clearly still believes in unicorns. Talk about naiive and doing HIS role and workload FOR him? He's lazy. And she's willing to do all of that, including the pretending, because of how incredibly addicteed to him she is (he's the supplier of the drug in her own head that he got her on...she has to keep him).
She may as well have just proposed to HERSELF, eh!
If a man can't afford a mere engagement ring then he DEFINITELY can't afford to take the marital Provider (or even Co-Provider) position, either (duuh?). The constantly changing jobs (which they "big up") fits perfectly with a Low-Functioning Spath, though. They get fired a lot. Can't cooperate or take orders from anyone. The High-Functionals are clever enough to get a real hold over their boss and blackmail him/her into giving them a free lift up the company ladder (e.g. or I'll lift the lid on your Alcoholism...never put that bluntly, though). There again, bosses do leave.
(You're right! Pinning her down, in isolation or in context of what HE is, in order to identify her more clearly is indeed very difficult, for all the chaos and extra, not-nice characters! But it may because, where he's straight-forward to ID, she isn't because she isn't one or isn't straightforwardly anything. Let me just re-read under that BPD light, see if it fits...because she might be a pretentious liar purely andonly as a method for avoiding rejection and abandonment - which is self-defense, not other-attack...unlike him who's conned her out of half her house.)
Is the house under a mortgage or owned outright?
Is his name on the Deeds? If so - who was first to ring and organise the bank meeting?
She is SO ignorant and naiive. Maybe SHE'S the Aspie! But only just Functional, not Higher?
"then...I was begged to sit up on the phone (babysit her) while her 25yr old made the non stop 14 hour plane flight to Canada (just incase the plane went down or something PLEASE)."
OH. OH, OH, OOOH. Hold the Press! Yes she is! This, IMO, is neurosis, a sign of being traumatic, still, and grossly insecure (just waiting for life to shoot the next bullet at her heart), not her deliberately wasting your time! And so she DOES love her kid and was just VENTING about being rid of him. There again, Aspies aren't that tameable and trainable.
She might be a cross-breed between NPD and ASD.
Sorry...said we'd leave that bit...finding it difficult to do, though, LOL.
But - QUESTIONS:
Can we agree that she is not hostile to you, not trying to get one over on you or deprive or mistreat you? If so, then she is more likely a Borderline. A victim.
And would you agree that if you had to use TWO WORDs to sum her up, they'd be this: DESPERATE (as in scared and over-needy) and FRANTIC?
" I foolishly did it. Left myself exhausted. More to that story!"
If I'm right then that was not foolish, it was kind and compassionate. But I can see why you might be trying to paint her tiresomeness Black. Because then you don't have to feel guilty about not being involved with her any more...because she makes you feel you have to sacrifice your own needs to hers, and exhausts you and you need a damn good, long break.
" Then sobbing when I pick up the phone 'Her Daughter has covid19 is beside herself alone in Canada says she is dying & scared apparently begging for help'. Criend & carried on for 2 hours at me until I said I had to go to pee & sleep. Then ANGER I wouldn't let her talk to me facetime while I watched the Queens funeral for its 4 hour duration. She is still calling me SELFISH because I said 'no'. There has been so much more but this is just the last 10 days coping with her.
Sorry there is so much more!"
Yup. She knows she needs help - from a therapist - but hasn't the money or wherewithall to seek one so is, regrettably, fall back on you.
I think a lot of what has contributed to this is your inability to be honest with her - BECAUSE you don't know how to handle her. Me, I would have suggested this:
Sis. I am exhausted. But I promise I will call you back tomorrow at x time. But I can only one hour so if we don't get everything said and discussed in that time you'll have to do a second instalment later/the next day. If you reassure her that you're there but ON YOUR TERMS TOO (OR WHOLLY), she should calm down a heck of a lot.
Want to try that experiment - since she IS back in contact with you already?
Okay. Here it is. Here's why you don't have room for your sister right now (as feels like 'any more'). You've got your OWN bullies on your back!
But - AND here is the other. She DID attack you.
Well, let's forget her for the moment...he'll be on relatively good behaviour for the next 6 months.
Want to talk about these disgusting-sounding neighbours?
PS: Apologies for the back-and-forth processing-out-loud. I'm a bit knackered.
PPS: It sounds childish because the antagonist is exactly that. A child (in a grown body).
PPPS: She could have a thousand. Doesn't make any of them friends. Or contacts worth having. If your three are quality?, then - brilliant! Keeps the riff-raff out, LOL.
Yeah, I've read your posts again. She does fit Benign Narc. However, with him I'm under no uncertainties or illusions. He has to go. Before half or more of her money does.
I also think that attack was payback for her having felt you hadn't given her enough support. I think he's got her in the Sweet part of the sweet-mean cycle so, confidence having returned, deluding herself that whatever the rocky period was, it's now over, meaning, she's safe to air her resentment at you...going typically too far (for too far already) in criticising your kids (probably not, probably just because it would be bound to upset you).
You and she do not communicate well, though. There's no direct honesty, is there.
Also, had you lately too drastically reduced the level of support and attention she'd for far too many years become accustomed to expecting? If you want to introduce or re'lay rules and boundaries with a Narc, you can't do it in one huge adjustment down, like that. That's a red rag to a bull, that is. It's got to be done gradually or in ways that APPEAL to her.
Why don't you have a once-weekly phonecall? If you're GOING to be shoved into therapist position, then, mmake like a therapist!
Those are your NEW rules - and your solution to greater harmony between you both, you can say. Take em or leave em or find a paid therapist.
Thank you for reading & responding Soulmate.
I'm just a bit too hurt to 'get over it' this time.
Too much over the years from her sector.
Saying I 'deserve' the treatment from my new neighbours is beyond hurtful.
Saying I 'deserve' the life I have is NOT acceptable treatment from your only Sister.
I have been there for her so very much as she is very 'twisted'.
Always she believes she is the object of all men's desire. I've seen her in action & it leaves me shocked. Strange men in pubs & clubs
she cons on to. Even in front of their partners.
Not one of 3 Uncles has not been accused of wanting her (she tells me). She phones them for chats until their wives tell her no more calls thanks.
My Brothers school mates they wanted her to (she tells me). By the way the females in this family are all pretty ordinary. My Cousin is considered the beautiful one (not my Sis). No Elle McPherson here!
Gran did not do anything (physical) to her ever!!! He was an Exemplary Man. Trust me. I would know. I was the closest to him.
She only saw Gran once a year. My Brother won't EVER talk to her again for spreading such Rumours throughout all family & friends.
He is disgusted! He has estranged himself from 'the mental lush' his words for years now.
What he doesn't know is that he's become her next victim. She is now telling me fanciful, sexual stories about Bro & her.
More of her 'secrets' revealed to lucky me & the threats of just don't tell anybody.
If my Brother heard what she is saying I think he would do her in! Her sexual desire siren stories are starting to become a bit 'sick' & 'twisted'.
I've talked to her about her thoughts & feelings on this topic about 100+ times. Tried to be an emotional crutch. I've given her both empathy & sympathy. But I NEVER AGREED to her alleged version of the truth in regards to Grandad because I KNOW HER! I'VE SEEN HER IN ACTION.
Today, I find out she's had a bitch session about me to an Aunt she knows I've never been fussed on. I felt I'd made head way with this Aunt over the last 2 years at getting to know & understand each other better. Sis knew this:(
Your words Soulmate: And would you agree that if you had to use TWO WORDs to sum her up, they'd be this: DESPERATE (as in scared and over-needy) and FRANTIC?
YES...I AGREE (I'd say FPP Disorder) and she is very damaging & demanding.
Also you stated Soulmate: You've kept a lot in, for a very long time, haven't you?
YES...so many of her 'secrets' I've been threatened to keep over the years. I could have told them all what she is truly like to deal with.
They believe the 'Angel Goddess Intuitive Medium of Love & Light'. That is this years character. She changes herself to whatever pleases each new man. She's been a Biker Chic, A Singer in a Pop Band, A Cowgirl, A Hippy & so much more so many differing people. I wonder who she really is?
I always felt it 'sad'. NOW after years of enduring her fake personas & chameleon behaviour I'm angry. It is a crutch she uses to hide behind. I think my Brother & I may be the ONLY person not sucked in who really know her. I'm angry because I think she saves the 'real person' for me and that person is not very nice.
Soulmate regarding your comment: OH. OH, OH, OOOH. Hold the Press! Traumatic and grossly insecure (just waiting for life to shoot the next bullet at her heart). This description best suits me? Odd that?
Footnote: She does CARE about her two adult kids. But she was a self centred Mother. Off at pubs & parties drunk always & often. If not this then she was at Hippy Retreats for her 'ME' Time. She had A LOT OF ME TIME!
Also, with regards to money. She is rich. Very well off & has been for years thanks to her ex-husband & divorce settlement. She buys the men motorbikes, utility trucks, caravans etc & now a house.
For Christmas last year I got zero even though I sent her a thoughtful gift (she collects penguin figurines).
The Christmas before I got a washer & soap which I've seen at our local dollar store in total spent $5. Thought that counts right?
My Birthday just past I got zero.
Soulmate Statement: Some improve with age, while some get worse...and the fact you've finally cracked, indicates that she's the latter and that your 'bucket hath overflowed'. YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Soulmate Question: What happened, in your opinion, that you can think of, turned her that way (obviously when still a child)?
Answer: We 3 siblings were emotionally & physically abused. Bro (oldest), Sis (Middle Child Syndrome) & Me (Youngest). WE WERE NEVER SEXUALLY ABUSED!!! Stated with Emphasis.
I do appreciate having somebody to talk things over with on this site. It helps. Thanks
"Thank you for reading & responding Soulmate."
No, worries, that's what we're here for. It's so important to talk it all out. Bear in mind, however, that I can't always post daily, but it's only ever a case of When, not If ("I'll be back!").
"I'm just a bit too hurt to 'get over it' this time. Too much over the years from her sector."
Completely understand and faienoughski. You're in an emotionally battered state, still. And in fact, her latest stunts would have hurt even more, ironically, following having had a break from her and her nonsense. But, you need to get with reality and know that you're never as powerless as they manage to make you feel. It's the opposite - hence why whenever they interact with you they always do SOMETHING to throw you, confuse, exhaust, shock or downright stun you (or if a romantic relationship - literally get you high by Love-Bombing you)...all of that. They're perfectly aware they're no match for you if you're your normal, sober, compus mentus self.
"Saying I 'deserve' the treatment from my new neighbours is beyond hurtful."
The judgement or accusation itself is BS. The trying to hurt you is the point. Equally, she could have called you Fattie. Get what I'm saying? In fact, easier for her to just say: I resent you...bloody constantly...for nothing except for my warped thinking as makes me resent you - FOR NOT BEING MY MUM whenever I click my fingers! (see it?).
"Saying I 'deserve' the life I have is NOT acceptable treatment from your only Sister."
It is when it's because they're psychologically disturbed. You have to learn not to take it any more seriously than if you were babysitting someone's toddler and he/she yelled, I HATE YOU! Would you go curl up in the foetal position in the corner and start crying? It's more correct to say, having a sister who's mind is so unhealthy she treats her sister that constantly-disgustingly, is not acceptable.
Once you get your head around all of this/what's wrong with her (its your emotional side that takes so long to catch up) you'll see her as that little toddler (mostly in a permanently bad/dramatic mood, granted) and will no longer be capable of taking her even remotely seriously. You might find even find her secretly amusing (whenever not constantly irritated, obviously, LOL).
"I have been there for her so very much as she is very 'twisted'.
Yes. And again, I'm changing my mind. Because now, in your further descriptions, we have Sexually Provocative...which again, is far more characteristic of your Narcissistic Sociopath (NPD AsPD) than straight malignant Narcissist (NPD).
"Gran did not do anything (physical) to her ever!!! He was an Exemplary Man. Trust me. I would know. I was the closest to him.
She only saw Gran once a year. My Brother won't EVER talk to her again for spreading such Rumours throughout all family & friends.
He is disgusted! He has estranged himself from 'the mental lush' his words for years now.
What he doesn't know is that he's become her next victim. She is now telling me fanciful, sexual stories about Bro & her.
More of her 'secrets' revealed to lucky me & the threats of just don't tell anybody.
If my Brother heard what she is saying I think he would do her in! Her sexual desire siren stories are starting to become a bit 'sick' & 'twisted'."
Yup. And, that's okay - just wanted you to check. I believe you. Particularly with this extra data about her - let's face it - consumated or not - PROMISCUITY. Scuse expression, but, does she also happen to dress like a cheap prostitute as well?
"I've talked to her about her thoughts & feelings on this topic about 100+ times. Tried to be an emotional crutch. I've given her both empathy & sympathy. But I NEVER AGREED to her alleged version of the truth in regards to Grandad because I KNOW HER! I'VE SEEN HER IN ACTION."
She can't learn and can't be got through to, then (Tick!). And her provocative behaviour's becoming a bit, quote, sick and twisted.
Yeah. Houston, I think we are seeing a Malignant morph into a Spath. She has elements of the ridiculously petty and trivial mixed with downright dangerous - and frankly prosecute-able - levels of slander.
"Today, I find out she's had a bitch session about me to an Aunt she knows I've never been fussed on. I felt I'd made head way with this Aunt over the last 2 years at getting to know & understand each other better. Sis knew this:( "
Auntie will have to find out for herself, then, won't she. (Won't be long, now that I know sis- I mean, blister is in transition.)
"Your words Soulmate: And would you agree that if you had to use TWO WORDs to sum her up, they'd be this: DESPERATE (as in scared and over-needy) and FRANTIC?
YES...I AGREE (I'd say FPP Disorder) and she is very damaging & demanding."
She's probably co-morbidly Histrionic as well...not exactly uncommon - most have co-morbidies. But anyway, let's just rely on the label HUGELY TOXIC. We're talking, Ruin people's lives level. Clearly. But a (fake or real or bit of both) Vulnerable (think of it more as a style than a mindset...so - FAKED tears for manipulation, real ones when feeling selfishly, unreasonably, irrationally, hypocritically, sorry for herself (e.g. when caught red-handed)).
"Also you stated Soulmate: You've kept a lot in, for a very long time, haven't you?
YES...so many of her 'secrets' I've been threatened to keep over the years. I could have told them all what she is truly like to deal with."
Yup. That's one of the ways they get you. Hence, Auntie left confused again after you'd just straightened her out (true?).
Little Bo Beep has lost her sheep and doesn't know where to find them. Leave them alone and they'll come home, wagging their tails behind them (i.e. pleased and relieved to see you, and now believing you).
If it helps: what do you think this thread poses as? Answer: evidence to show Auntie. For the simple reason that only genuine victims WRITE DIARIES...which is what these threads are, right? Bullies, on the other hand, are lazy minded first and foremost. Bullying/manipulating is their McMothod for getting what they want because their ego is too ill to let them ASK NICELY or ACCEPT OTHER PEOPLE'S YES OR NO. You're lucky if you can get them to write one bloody sentance - even if they wanted to create a false impression of victimhood, no WAY would they come here and go to all this effort (haha, do what?). So that's handy.
"They believe the 'Angel Goddess Intuitive Medium of Love & Light'. That is this years character."
Well, the way she's going - by next year, with any luck, she'll be Marie Antoinette or (better yet) Daffy Duck (especially if she does the voice LOL). A constant, giant self-delusion (the crux symptom as a symptom of Attachment Disorder), left for so long unchallenged and unchecked, will just keep getting worse so, although I jest - it's needn't be so far from the truth.
So now, with this inarguable Spath behavioural package you've just described, we know she goes beyond such normally 'Benign' trivia and into actual Dangerous Emotional AND Social Predator territory (Spath).
But anyway, at least it sounds as if ENOUGH family members know she's mentally round the twist, so that's lucky.
"She changes herself to whatever pleases each new man. She's been a Biker Chic, A Singer in a Pop Band, A Cowgirl, A Hippy & so much more so many differing people. I wonder who she really is?"
Literally nobody. She stopped being Her, EONS ago. Basically, your sister tantamountedly died when you both little. And this creature's all that's left. Does that resound with you?
"I always felt it 'sad'. NOW after years of enduring her fake personas & chameleon behaviour I'm angry."
GOOD. That's helpful too. Means you're ready for action, PLUS is your Turbo as well as self-generateable anaesthetic. So any time you need to be angry, just come on here and read her rap sheet. In fact, if you were to literally gather the above info and descriptions INTO a bulleted rap-sheet, that'd make it even easier for you.
Your rap sheet is going to literally be your Go To antidote to her next lot of hoovering attempts.
"It is a crutch she uses to hide behind. I think my Brother & I may be the ONLY person not sucked in who really know her. I'm angry because I think she saves the 'real person' for me and that person is not very nice."
Definitely. It's because she's convinced herself that she's the star and your the ever-doting sidekick...the only person who (she mistakenly thinks) will always let her get away with it. She probably feels a whole lot better (albeit never for long) after locking horns with you or using you as her human toilet to rant and puke into. They have to pick on someone, eh.
"Soulmate regarding your comment: OH. OH, OH, OOOH. Hold the Press! Traumatic and grossly insecure (just waiting for life to shoot the next bullet at her heart). This description best suits me? Odd that?"
No, they're actually not your own feelings. Only ones in (constant) reaction to her make you take on her feelings (whereupon she feels better and you're left with the misery she had before she rang). She, basically, has been giving you the same treatment whomever or WHAT-ever it was, for too long abused HER. Along with her negative emotions. DUMPING on you, basically. Dumping her toxic, constantly self-replenishing, waste.
"Footnote: She does CARE about her two adult kids. But she was a self centred Mother."
That's what was confusing me: that mixture of benign and malignant again.
"Off at pubs & parties drunk always & often. If not this then she was at Hippy Retreats for her 'ME' Time. She had A LOT OF ME TIME!"
How has no-one close to her ever frog-marched her to her doctors before???
What about you? Didn't you realise your (once-)sister was basically round the bend just that bit too much? Or did you think she would mature, eventually, thus grow out of it?
"Also, with regards to money. She is rich. Very well off & has been for years thanks to her ex-husband & divorce settlement. She buys the men motorbikes, utility trucks, caravans etc & now a house."
Well, she won't stay rich behaving like that, for one - and, two, now what is about to become HALF a house.
Spaths are incredibly irresponsible with money...fritter it, never save it (can always easy-peasy scam some more).
"For Christmas last year I got zero even though I sent her a thoughtful gift (she collects penguin figurines).
The Christmas before I got a washer & soap which I've seen at our local dollar store in total spent $5. Thought that counts right?"
Yes. But here there wasn't any.
"My Birthday just past I got zero."
Then I suggest you turn your effort and attention more towards your brother, your sane sibling.
"Soulmate Statement: Some improve with age, while some get worse...and the fact you've finally cracked, indicates that she's the latter and that your 'bucket hath overflowed'. YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"
Sorry, what was that - speak up? LOL
That shows me you need to do quite a lot more reading-up. Knowledge is power - and balm (for insult and grieving pains).
"Soulmate Question: What happened, in your opinion, that you can think of, turned her that way (obviously when still a child)?
Answer: We 3 siblings were emotionally & physically abused. Bro (oldest), Sis (Middle Child Syndrome) & Me (Youngest). WE WERE NEVER SEXUALLY ABUSED!!! Stated with Emphasis."
Then she must have been the weaker and more sensitive sibling, and it was too much for her, as opposed to you two. (PS Middle Child Syndrome is usually a product and sign of narcissistic parenting).
"I do appreciate having somebody to talk things over with on this site. It helps. Thanks"
No worries. :-)
Homework: The all-in-one rap sheet, if you please?
PS: She certainly ACTS like SOMEONE got to ongoingly sexually violate her, that's all I can say.
What - no clue who?
Sorry, but, unless she was born with a VERY high genetic `pre-disposition, compared to you and brother who withstood that amount/weight - someone abused the heck out of her. Plus, she's had the valuing of her 'inner sanctity' self, practically removed. Do you see what and why I'm seeing and saying? Train a kid to (have to) act too often like a tart - or in a way once or twice that impacted indelibly - and by adulthood she'll be nicely trained, thank-you. Maybe think harder? And what if she didn't even know which adult male it was because it was always too dark and her, half asleep? (Some kids think they dreamt it at first.)
PPS: FFP belongs in Cluster A. It's the Cluster Bs that are the only mental illness group whose illness makes everyone else around them suffer, either equally with them or more than, or solely-exclusively. However, since FFP is more a trait than a full-blown PD in its own right, it's possible she could have that as a 'side dish', but, then, I imagine it would likely have pre-dated the onset (or completion I should say) of her narcissism, plus the etiology of narcissistic pathological delusion + self-delusion and FFP are very similar anyway.
Two of the easiest distinguishing marks of a Spath as opposed to a Malignant narc, however, are: (1) NO SHAME. And (2) stupid risk-taking in combo with disregard for consequences (like Libelling her relatives and breaking up families). (Third is non-stop Pathological Lying and trouble separating truth/reality from lie/delusion.) But Spaths are not Psychos (except in the court's eyes, purely for crimes in-common, albeit those psychos are LOW-functioning ergo closer to the Sociopath (hence the constant confusion out there) (again, it's not just the which and when but the extreme-nesses/degree). For starters Spaths are too thick and impulsive to be labelled Psycho. Yes, the two share traits but, mainly, they're just THE SAME WEIGHT...both (almost) AS EXTREME. Well, depending on whether they manage to get themselves firmly ensconced into any societal position of power, of course (think Putin...he who clearly DOESN'T think, as opposed to a true (malignant/pathological) Psychopath (you get good ones too - with skilled parenting)).
Truthfully, I see a whole sodding smorgasbord with your ex-sister! I see BPD, Benign + Malignant NPD, Sociopathy, touch of paranoia, DEFINITELY persecution-complex... And talk about greedy?! I think she's Combo Woman (ref Sandra M Brown). That's so rare, I think she might actually have been born a boy in a girl's body as well (genetic blips all round!). Anything pinging when I say that?
Plus she's a mixture of Covert-Vulnerable and Overt-Grandiose, as well as Somatic and Cerebral (you've got to be 'intelligent' enough to be a Covert).
Intruiging and repulsing at the same time. Bit of a new one on me.
You have my DEEPEST sympathies, though (good god!).
"If my Brother heard what she is saying I think he would do her in! "
Do her in?
Oh, would he, indeed.
Tell me more about what brother's like and capable of?
"That's so rare, I think she might actually have been born a boy in a girl's body as well (genetic blips all round!). Anything pinging when I say that?"
Watch the tapes again from all the times you've witnessed her coming into men and married men. Would the degree of her sexual-aggressiveness aka hunter-predatory style be considerably less shocking, a lot more acceptable, if she were a man? If you re-imagine all those scenes with her AS a man...? Try that.
Hello out there, need to vent. Talking things out with myself. Would love some input. Many queries to answer having read Soul Mates responses. I just haven't gotten to them yet. Busy. Stressed. It is 4:20am in the morning & I haven't gone to bed yet. Too busy arguing with my adult daughter about her Aunt. It seems I'm what is wrong with this world. I handle everything in the incorrect manner which is not society acceptable.
Daughter is angry at me. Daughter is on Aunts side. So I'm an Island it seems. Why? Because I'm defending incest & protecting my Grandfather (daughters Great Grandfather). I'm protecting the guilty I'm told. Been told I'm sick & twisted tonight. The history being as follows:
I kept this secret for years. I considered it a one-off experience I had with my Grandfather. I was about 13 years old. It was a bad night. It was a sad night. Gran & Uncle were to mind me whilst Mother & Grandmother had a ladies night out. They were to make me dinner & play cards with me. Then the plan was at 10pm we (Gran & me) were to go pick up the women folk.
What transpired was 'Home Brew' & LOTS OF IT! Gallons. Me ignored. Me told to go away & find something to do. I went upstairs but would observe them from the top level hallway. Uncle & Gran downed beer after beer. Got louder. Sang funny tunes. Attempted to turn on the stove to cook themselves some food. Then called me down & Uncle in a derogatory tone (I NEVER LIKED HIM & WOULD REFER TO HIM AS GOD) told me to prepare them some food. Calling me 'woman' & laughing hysterically at their own antics.
I didn't say much. Was quite shocked. So I asked what to make. They said a toasted sandwich would suffice. I began putting the bread out.
Then Gran said not to worry about the food. It was nearly time to go get the women. His speech was slurred badly & he could not stand up without swaying. Same goes for Uncle. There was a snide comment made by Uncle that I was growing up fast. Even at that tender age I sensed his words with the nod & gesture intimated something else. As an adult now I know it was stated in a lurid tone. I turned the stove off & put the bread away. As I was leaving the kitchenette my Grandfather pulled me to him & said 'shall we dance?'. There was a radio on low in the background. I'd not noticed it before as they were making quite the racket with their drunken nonsense.
As Gran pulled me in to him I wriggled to get away & said I didn't want to dance that I wanted to go get Mum now. It all happened very quickly as I recall. Uncle said 'she doesn't want to dance with you Dad. This one thinks she's better than us. We disgust her. She wants Mummy now'. He said the last phrase sarcastically. As I went to take further steps away (unknown to me) Gran came up from behind & put his arms across my chest trapping me to him very tightly. His arms were exactly across my breasts (which were big for my age). He said to Uncle 'growing up very nicely' & tightened his grip making my bust squashed & held firmly against his arms. I was unable to get free. I felt scared. I began to cry. When I started to cry Uncle began laughing. Calling me a cry baby. Gran was looking down at me. I was aware he knew & could see that he'd made my bosom bulge as they were restrained so hard. It did hurt. I remember I said 'let me go! then I'll tell Mum'.
Gran let go straight away & I bolted for the staircase crying. Uncle was angry now & said 'breathe a word of tonight to your Mother & you'll be sorry'. I hid in the long sliding door cupboard in one of the bedrooms sobbing but trying to muffle my tears fearful they'd come up after me. I was shaking. I had not had a drink, food or anything in the whole evening. I'd kept to myself until they wanted food.
It was a long wait in there. The small Villa echoed when they spoke very loudly due to being drunk. The phone rang at around 11pm. I'd stuck my head out of the cupboard long enough to look at the clock which I knew as on the bedroom wall. It was the women furious they had been standing in the dark on the corner of a tavern waiting to be collected for an hour. I heard that they weren't going to come get them because they'd been drinking. I heard them get told to 'catch a cab'. I heard the argument about the cost of that. I heard 'she is asleep in her room upstairs so can't leave her to get you anyway'. That was a lie about me.
Some time later...a long time. I heard a car pull up outside, car doors slammed & the key turned in the villa door. I waited until I heard footsteps on the staircase. Loud yelling had begun. The women furious at the men. I took my chance & ran down those stairs & straight into my Mothers unsuspecting arms. I very nearly knocked her off her feet. I was sobbing. Mum demanded to know what had been going on here? She stated I was 'white as a ghost'. Nanna was yelling at Gran & asking if I'd been fed. I was led upstairs to the Holiday Unit room I was sharing with Mum & I was still sobbing, gulping, choking on tears. Never been more happy to see Mum & Nana in my life. Even though young I felt instinctively that tonight had a sinister vibe. He did not seem like my Grandad. His voice was deeper. His tone was scary. It held implications. This Gran was a stranger to me. Not the usual loving, jokester I'd always adored. In contrast I was use to my Uncle being a jerk & was very glad this was one of his fleeting visits to see the relatives (usually flew in for 5 days once a year to visit his folks...my Grandparents).
This event spelled the end of what was to be a week at the beach when Mum would catch up with her Brother. The fighting went on until the sun came up. At first light my Mum dragged me & herself in a cab to the nearest bus stop & we headed home. I'd told her what had transpired. She was ropeable. When we got home Mum was still angry & on the phone to her younger brother whom had already been on the phone with his Mother (my Grandmother). I was sent to my room. Told to stay in there & have a nap.
When I got up my other Uncle (Mums youngest Bro) turned up to our house to chat about THINGS? I was once again told to stay in my room. I was happy to hide out. I was feeling like I had done something wrong. I wondered what the men had told them. Perhaps that I'd made it up? Mum was estranged from Gran for weeks. She did however talk to Nanna on the phone during that time. I overheard 'what went on?', 'They were terribly drunk'. I was always sent out of the room.
Eventually weeks later Mum had a chat to me. Said 'they were so drunk they didn't realise what they were doing and that it was best let go & forgotten'. I asked if I was in trouble? She said 'no'. I asked if Grandad was angry at me & she said 'no'. So it was quite sometime before I saw Gran again & I do recall that first visit was awkward & so were many visits after for a time. I felt scared. I felt I could not trust him. I felt hurt. I'd always held him in such high esteem.
When Grandmother got me alone she said 'he was being silly is all. Didn't mean anything. went a bit stupid. It was the home brew'. She said he was embarrassed & sorry. She told me to carry on as though nothing had happened & they would also. She asked me not to say anything to anybody as no real harm was done. Just two old, tired, drunk men. Don't worry we won't leave you alone with them again.
That was it! Case closed. I lived my life. I grew up.
I NEVER WAS THE SAME AROUND MY 'GRANDADDY' I use to call him. As my Father PO ages ago. I use to leave notes for him on his pillow with little wrapped chocolates. I use to fish with him. Cook with him. Dance with him. Play cards & board games with him. I use to shop alone with him.
After this event I gave him a wide berth for years. Until I was an adult. I told nobody. The secret remained with the four of them. Gran, Nanna, Uncle & Mum. It didn't get spread to the rest of the family. Mums younger Bro had been told 'the men got loud & drunk and frightened me'. End of discussion.
IN CONCLUSION: I chose not to tell my daughter this story. I never told my Sister this story. I never told anybody. But I accidentally blurted it out the night my sister came to the door shocked that Gran had told her a sexual fantasy he'd had about her.
My daughter is furious with me. For not ever having told her about that night (I did protect her by NEVER leaving her alone with him). She recalls when he asked to take her & teach her swimming I said 'no'. She recalls when he wanted to teach her to ride her bike just the two of them down the park I said I'd come along & he said 'no just us or nothing'. I said 'looks like nothing then'. As a child she said she noticed I wouldn't leave her with him alone. Even under their house when I was upstairs watching the Soap Opera's with Nan well Gran asked to take my girl downstairs & teach her Snooker but I said 'no'.
She believes her Aunt & says I'm the bad one. For never telling my experience until now. It is just that my Sister has been such a (sorry for this but prick tease) her whole life.
I no longer know how to feel nor what to say anymore in this family. I'm left speechless. Nanna & Gran are long gone. It was only after Gran died that Sister started telling everybody about her experience with Gran & his 'sex fantasy story about her'. I've been tarnished a bad Mother & bad Sister. So I guess it must be so.
You're out there with me, lol, but, yes - Hi.
Bear with, if you please - be with you either later today or this evening.
Time to talk to myself some more. No person to chat with since 9 Oct. Today being 14 Oct. Having many issues. Getting more
than a bit over this life & the people in it. I literally have nobody! How many people can say that?
I had one daughter & she hates me 90% of the time. Its ok as I am not happy with her, disappointed in her, bored with her. Oh lets be honest I've over her 90% of the time.
Her personality sucks. She is mean spirited. She is selfish. She is a user. She tells lies. She is everything I don't respect. Frustration turned to absolute disappointment a number of years back. I realise it was all for nothing.
The time, the effort, the money, the devotion, the help, the listening until your ears bleed, the being used & abused. Helping with her problems while there was nobody there for me. When I had her the Grandmother said 'oh the joy of Motherhood!'. What fucking joy? Where is the joy?
It has been 31 years! I want my bloody joy! I've nothing left to give of myself. I'm worn ragged. Old before my time. The journey has been too hard, too long, too filled with pot holes & very rocky roads. I kept waiting for her to grow up. Mature. Get on with her own life. IT NEVER HAPPENED!
I find her a demanding, complaining, spoilt, lazy brat. Not a 31 year old independent woman. She always sides with anybody against me. Like my Sister. She has NEVER had my back. I feel I'm here only to be a slave to her 24/7. I've had no life of my own & it is her fault. Her needs & wants always out did mine. I always had to cave.
I WANT TO BE FREE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! As a single Mum solo parent I waited for it. I've longed for it. Now I believe it will never happen. She refuses to grow up. Kidult. I was more responsible, independent, mature at 10 years of age than she is now. Honestly. I need to vent. So much is wrong in my life. Always has been. Always will be.
NOTHING IN MY DAILY LIFE, WEEK TO WEEK, MONTH TO MONTH OR YEAR TO YEAR IS NORMAL.
I'm so sorry - I'm here! Flitting back and forth around the house but - give me a tick to read up and respond...
"What transpired was 'Home Brew' & LOTS OF IT! Gallons. Me ignored. Me told to go away & find something to do. I went upstairs but would observe them from the top level hallway. Uncle & Gran downed beer after beer. Got louder. Sang funny tunes. Attempted to turn on the stove to cook themselves some food. Then called me down & Uncle in a derogatory tone (I NEVER LIKED HIM & WOULD REFER TO HIM AS GOD) told me to prepare them some food. Calling me 'woman' & laughing hysterically at their own antics. "
I hear a Narcissist speaking. And acting.
Only narcissists would get drunk in-charge of a child and frankly, demonstrate by the way they act that it was normal business (was for them, clearly).
You've got to stop keeping secrets and start talking to people - properly, at length.
But I'm very confused because we've all of a sudden gone from ABSOLUTELY NO WAY to yuo admitting it absolutely IS - and giving a very clear and detailed example.
What brought that on?
I've read everything though, more than once. However, I do need you to address everything in my previous posts before we move on to any further-flung event or development, if you please?
PS: Venting messages are fine - they're good and healthy. But when you answer my points and queries, please give me just the very to-the-point answer and allow me to ask if I need more data. That okay?
"So much is wrong in my life. Always has been."
Yes. But at least it's all mess in the one same box of the one same nature. So it's truer to say it's FULL of emotionally messy issues and issue-riddens.
"Always will be."
Not possible. And not now. Because we're going to get you to start making changes. As Einstein BASICALLY says, that when it's down to us (i.e. not even Fate can drop something new in out-of-the-Blue as quickly as you need), nothing different is going to happen unless you put something new into the mix.
"NOTHING IN MY DAILY LIFE, WEEK TO WEEK, MONTH TO MONTH OR YEAR TO YEAR IS NORMAL."
EDIT: NOTHING IN MY DAILY LIFE, WEEK TO WEEK, MONTH TO MONTH OR YEAR TO YEAR HAS SO FAR BEEN NORMAL SO I'M GOING TO START MAKING LITTLE TINY CHANGES HERE AND THERE AND THEN WONDER AT THE MAGIC OF WHAT HAPPENS WHEN ONE CHANGES ONESELF AND THE MOVES ONE MAKES INSTEAD OF TRYING TO INFLUENCE/CHANGE OTHER PEOPLE OR SITTING AROUND WISHING YOU COULD, BECAUSE IT MEANS YOU'VE BEEN TRYING TO TACKLE THE PROBLEM FROM WRONG END.
Sorry - this might not have been clear and precise enough so I'll edit.
But I'm very confused because we've all of a sudden gone from ABSOLUTELY NO WAY, NOT GRAN, I SHOULD KNOW, I GUARANTEE IT to yuo admitting it absolutely IS the case as suspected - and giving a very lucid and detailed account.
What brought that on?
What brought that on? you ask.
My 31yr old daughter is the answer.
Daughter felt she needed to enlighten the dumb arse that is me with what is & isn't socially acceptable behaviour according
to the current times. I listened to her for over an hour. I analysed her very in depth, clear & concise lecture. By the
end of it I had to admit that she was right. Her finishing statement said "Why the hell did you think that was OK behaviour Mum? I know
you were just a young girl but come on!".
It is just like you stated Soulmate 'demonstrate by the way they act that it was normal business (was for them, clearly)'. In my family
in growing years it was parties & picnics where the adults got loud, drunk & fought all the time. Therefore (in my 13yr old mind) I saw this experience as a one-off misdemeanour rather than a real problem. When not drunk my Gran was a super great person.
So now I'm re-reading & going through all your messages to try & answer to help you out with understanding.
This comment from you really jumped out at me...
(PS "Favourites" doesn't happen in healthy families.) Really? No seriously? No wonder I'm so unhinged mentally. I honestly
believed that was common place & generally accepted by all. We got given labels. Each & every one of us (by Gran) from 'Lazy Turd' given to
my daughter to 'Brain dead desert head' my proud title amongst many more added along the way over the years. Once again I thought this was
a tactic by my elder whom I loved & respected to get me to work on myself more & improve the way people perceive me. I never considered it damaging.
Female Cousin (best looking of the bunch) was Princess & Fire Engine.
She looked good but when she talked or worse still cried her voice was like the siren switched on as the truck headed to a fire.
My Sister (Grans favourite) he'd sing lines of a popular olden day song! He called her Lulu & Sal.
The song was 'Don't bring LuLu' by the Andrew Sisters'. Hullabaloo loo, don't bring Lulu,
I'll bring her myself! Fuck me (sorry for the french but for the first time in my life I just googled all the lyrics. I only knew the few
lines he especially chose & gave his twist on. I am now crying & disturbed. Gran had clear issues. Gran was lusting after my Sister:( OMG
I'm so going through something very close to (if not) a meltdown. I'm typing this about Gran feeling guilty because I adored
the man & clearly still do. I'm typing this feeling so awful about the things I said about my own daughter. I LOVE HER! Make no
mistake but she's grown into a personality I find really difficult. WE don't mesh:(
There is not a single person alive in this World at the moment whom I could say 'gets me'.
I feel like the worse possible version of myself. I'm bad mouthing everybody. I'm so unhappy. I hate people.
I hate life. I hate the World. Mums neighbour & good friend died this morning & all I could think was how lucky she is that
it is all over.
I am honestly emotionally drained. Physically falling apart (with health issues). I'm 54 and feel 104. I've crammed a lot into
my life but sadly most of it was bad. I know there were good times. I can resight them BUT it doesn't help when the pressures
get on top of me. I crack. I swear & carry on. I wish I didn't.
I'm not just disappointed in my Sister, Family, Life. I'm major disappointed with myself. I want to be a nicer person. I long
to be happy but everything is on top of me. I'm feeling pressure, weight etc.
Sorry all i'm being a sooky pain in the butt while others have real problems. I've tried to be patient waiting for responses.
Don't wish to take away from others. They deserve & need time to. I'm not unreasonable. A bit selfish & needy. I should be
above these rants.
Is the house under a mortgage or owned outright?
Is his name on the Deeds? If so - who was first to ring and organise the bank meeting?
Sorry I don't know the answer to any of these questions regarding my Sisters life. I only got the truth about the house
when she was slurred & drunk on the phone out of the blue.
I did not get given any private details.
You asked: Does Sister dress like a Pro? Answer: No She is 57yrs. She does wear sarongs a lot with just panties so flashes a bit. She does like to wear low cut blouses with her ample bust spilling out over the top showing her tiny tattoo of the Aussie flag. She dresses how the guy does she is with. So three years back leather pants & black leather jacket (he had a motorcycle), two years back the sarongs etc as he lived at the beach, one year back she was dressing in blouses & skirts high neck with chunky jewellery as he worked on computers (that one didn't last long as she flew to his daughters wedding after having known him 8 days & the relatives were NOT IMPRESSED! including ex-wife attending), so then she met another guy for a few coffees, then went on a boat cruise with another male who called her Princess until she told him his penis is too small to satisfy her (now on FB he calls her Bitch). Anyway, now this guy is a dust bowl, hole digging, pipe laying (no pun intended) cowboy type. So she is wearing plaid shirts, kerchief & Akubra Hat.
As aforementioned she has zero qualms about breaking up marriages over the years.
First was a male Principal of a school & his wife a teacher. She met him at a nightclub.
Told her the sad tale of their long term marriage but can't give him kids & how it caused angst between them.
Told Sis how his wife was PLAIN & not ATTRACTIVE like Sis.
She kept this going for awhile until the wife found out.
She dumped him? They ended up in divorce.
Next married man was a WEIRDO!!! Emphasis! OK to talk to but...? Well his looks alone scared the shit out of me LOL
He was known by all in their small town as TOPHAT. He wore a black long cloak/cape no matter our 40degree climate & a tall black old top hat.
He considered himself a stand out, a bit of a legend, a persona.
Sis befriended his wife & 3 yr old daughter. Bought the child gifts constantly. Wife was a tomboy type (just lovely I met her once) she had zero idea they were on together. Gran let them have relations for a week under his house in the party room knowing Top Hat was married:(
She'd told all she was coming here to take me out for my Birthday. I never saw her! Anyways, the adorable little girl adored her daddy & mummy.
When his wife eventually found out she was shattered. She took 3yr old & bolted. Little girl suffered deeply the loss of not seeing her daddy anymore.
Then Sis came here for a fleeting visit & secretly hooked back up with her old school boyfriend! They were doing the unthinkable at a Hotel
behind his wifes back. Also had a little girl. She also showered her in gifts. HE BROKE IT OFF WITH HER WHEN SHE BECAME TOO CLINGY & DEMANDING. She was pressuring the be with me (we were meant to be together since high school). He liked his wife & loved his 5yr old so said he'd never leave them. They are still together. Wife never found out.
The most recent thing she did that has pissed me off for her lack of scruples which I consider quite shocking was not long before she met
this latest fellow.
She got a casual position as a Minder/Carer for a woman with Dementia. The woman had been a highly regarded Therapist before she started
to forget things quite young in her early 50's. Sis job was to do house work for her, like cook dinner, general tidy up 3 times per week
for 5 hours. It paid really well! The woman & her husband were very affluent. Her adult children all lived overseas a Doc & a Lawyer (well done folks).
Her dementia was such that it was progressing slowly so she had long lucid periods of about 2 hours before becoming confused again. It dropped in & out. Long story short she ADORED her doting husband. They'd been together since teens. He spoilt her with gifts & did the housework when home & not working. Husband & wife made a pact. She had a lawyer organised everything & was going overseas at her own choosing to be euthanised in 15months time. IT isn't legal here. She did not want to become a burden, a dribbling fool or lose her self respect any further. Pride. Her adult kids knew it was her final wishes & it was all agreed upon & arranged.
Instead of cooking & cleaning my Sis would turn up with take away & a cake. Wait for the lady to be sane & have her analyse our Mother. She worked for her for 2 years. I noticed she kept mentioning her husband too much. Lingering to spend time when he got home. You get the picture.
My Sister with no embarrassment or remorse phoned me & said. We don't wish to hurt said lady but her husband will be with me when she is dead & he returns from the trip to have her euthanised. My Sis was very excited telling me he is both super handsome, super rich & the kind who dotes. He calls me his 'Angel' for helping his beloved wife out.
Well super clever wife had a lucid day (lasting hours & pretended to be forgetful & silly) she watched him & sis interact. She had the Police come & take my Sis away calling her a trespasser. The wife called a lawyer & she took out a Protection Order against Sis. Husband played innocent said he never realised sis was coming on to him & agreed to the Order. Angry wife then contacted all Home Helper Agencies in a 5 mile radius & gave them a photo of my sis & her details. She is now blocked from working with anybody with a disability again.
sis did however get a job as a Receptionist with a disability assistant service. When they found out about her history she was sacked two weeks later.
Just HOW LOW an my Sister go? No moral conscience.
Sorry. I'm now exhausted & drained so you must also be as well reading all this.
Like you said I've bottled so very much for many years. I'm cracking under the pressure of everything.
I feel 'broken'. I don't trust. I feel so very alone.
Anyway, I'm trying to answer all your queries. Openly & honestly for you.
Bro. He just may do her in (this is a sarcastic joke regularly used in Australia).
I have been estranged from Bro for over 7+ years. He is a type. Quick to anger, Rages/Tempers now getting counselling & on meds.
Judgmental. Opinionated. Chauvinistic. Gambler. Just left his wife & four kids.
He has high standards for women. He doesn't like sluts, tarts or those kind.
He has RULES for everything! Nobody meets with his approval. He labels & name calls.
I've always been a bit scared of him since childhood (I battled royal with him often).
Yet he has a softer side you see occasionally.
Non smoker. Non Drinker. He enjoys having a go at people. He debates everything. He went to Anger Management.
They tell me he is much better now. Calmer. He liked to punch holes in walls when stirred up. He liked to yell.
He liked to push me, shove me & slap me when a girl.
Apparently that is ALL in his past. He has always had issues. I guess that happens when your Father tries to run you over as you're
the Mothers favourite. (footnote: Dad tried to choke my Sis to death age 12. Doc called it Black Rages)
I'm totally f_ _ ked in the head hey? How can I not be? This is only a smidgeon of my life.
Hi, be with you tomorrow evening, bear with! And thanks - I can see from the amount of posts, you've been very thorough. :-)
I apologise how my thought patterns are all over the shop. A bit scattered & messy. Sorry:(
"What brought that on? you ask.
My 31yr old daughter is the answer.
Daughter felt she needed to enlighten the dumb arse that is me with what is & isn't socially acceptable behaviour according
to the current times. I listened to her for over an hour. I analysed her very in depth, clear & concise lecture. By the
end of it I had to admit that she was right. Her finishing statement said "Why the hell did you think that was OK behaviour Mum? I know
you were just a young girl but come on!".
Generation Z - born between 1996-2015 - at her far end - just the either side of 30 - are definitely CRYSTAL-clear about what is and isn't unacceptable or downright abusive. Previous generations, reverse-incrementally, had bad behaviour NORMALISED - because it was so rife...."everybody does it!".
Here...this clip is so damned hysterically funny for me because it is so close to the truth of what a Gen Z would be like in that situation! It probably won't make you laugh because you're not in a positon to right now. But the sober point remains:
Watch it now please. It's only a Short so won't take a min.
"It is just like you stated Soulmate 'demonstrate by the way they act that it was normal business (was for them, clearly)'. In my family
in growing years it was parties & picnics where the adults got loud, drunk & fought all the time."
You, evidently, grew up okay in SPITE of them, not Because. Reckon it was that massive shock that night...it would have been more than enough to have started you self-parenting and self-rearing.
"Therefore (in my 13yr old mind) I saw this experience as a one-off misdemeanour rather than a real problem. When not drunk my Gran was a super great person."
I think you mean you HOPED it was, and couldn't quite believe it that it might not have been...albeit, NOT ever again aimed at YOU.
Why? Have you got a champagne glass there? Go get one.
Too intelligent and strong-minded, too mature for your age (yes, you're right!), too perceptive, etc. to be - even though you were still more kid than young woman! - ANYONE'S - LITERALLY ANYONE'S - LIKE, I WOULDN'T CARE IF YOU WERE THE ANGEL BLOODY GABRIEL - YOU ARE STILL NOT RESTRAINING *ME* LIKE THAT - UNHAND ME OR I'M TELLING MY MUM!
Put another way, analogously: In a dark alleyway, a *rapist jumped out of the bushes at you from behind, you span round instantaneously whereby he didn't manage to get a grip on you, and went all Clint Eastwood on him (pmsl, wish I'd been there), boring your eyes into his and going, ....Go ahead, punk, make my day...
*He pounced on you from behind and restrained you from behind - don't forget that. That was "in a rape stylee".
That amount of confidence due to that incredible amount of inner certainty JUST INSTINCTUALLY - IN A KID?- is SO RARE. Too many kids, when they can't Fight because they're being tightly restrained automatically go to Freeze or Fawn - as the best chances of survival for the child, according to its child-stage base programming. (It's a narcissistic (normal-human level) i.e. self-protective REFLEX (no thinking by the sloooooow human, just, straight over to the inner animal and decision made in 0.0000007 seconds (not literally but there abouts)). It relies on experiences that got repeated so constantly they become assimilated into the genetic code as then becomes part of the next gen's make-up - i.e. genetic memory.
Where on earth...?!?! That is SO RARE...SO SO SO RARE! I only know one other person who at that young and awkward age did similarly!
Why aren't you working for the SAS?? Or just the army? Good god, woman - you`re OFFICER material at the very least!
Don't sip too much now, LOL...
But - good. We don't have to worry about you, now. You're a goliath of a survivor.
Question: did you KNOW you were this massive, this tough or is this news to you?
""When not drunk my Gran was a super great person"
That's malignant narcissists for you and why they're short-hand described most often as "Jekyll and Hyde".
(I also call the spath-narcs Tweedledumb and Tweedledumber lol)
Tsk - word fell off, supposed to read:
Too intelligent and strong-minded, too mature for your age (yes, you're right!), too perceptive, etc. to be - even though you were still more kid than young woman! - ANYONE'S - LITERALLY ANYONE'S VICTIM - LIKE, I WOULDN'T CARE IF YOU WERE THE ANGEL BLOODY GABRIEL - YOU ARE STILL NOT RESTRAINING *ME* LIKE THAT - UNHAND ME OR I'M TELLING MY MUM!
Good job he didn't push it. You'd have found a way to to get free, and attacked him. Taz of Tasmania style, probably. Put it this way - if you'd gone down, you'd have taken him down with you.
"So now I'm re-reading & going through all your messages to try & answer to help you out with understanding."
Cheers, m'dear! Am liking this neat & tidiness btw.
"This comment from you really jumped out at me...
(PS "Favourites" doesn't happen in healthy families.) Really? No seriously? No wonder I'm so unhinged mentally. "
1. Yes - seriously. Think about it - both from the (well-aware) non-favourites POV and then from the (also well-aware) favourite's POV because BOTH are direct victims and BOTH are deprived of your otherwise god-given privilege of a MUTUALLY CLOSE, TRUSTING, SIBLING, FOR-LIFE FRIEND. You woz all robbed, luvs. But that'll come right, mostly automatically now - no worries.
Go google Narcissistic Family Dynamics, or, Golden Child, Scapegoat (which will bring up the other roles in that sick play, which, note, can be swapped around to suit whatever IMPULSE-agenda of the narc bullies at any given time (cuckoo!)).
You're not unhinged (don't make me laugh!), you're merely trying to process an In-Tray as high as the Eiffel Tower, full of Lever-Arch files of Emotional & Event Data Sheets - EVERYTHING since back then - because when you get a "basis-bombing" piece of new data, it's a case of, THIS CHANGES EVERYTHING. Your brain is re-going over, every sheet in every file and having to edit them, re-file, swap over from files, cross reference multiply....put it this way: As a freelance, I once did a specialist filing system set-up and spent MONTHS sifting through the contents an entire room of big files (that were themselves a bloody mess).
That's how much slower things are when the A4 sheets are actual, physical ones, done by the new kid on the block (Conscious Us) but when your 'BACKROOM Gals' are doing it - with psychological, memory sheets, we're talking lightning. BUT STILL....it's not normally an Eiffel Tower-height's-worth. Or call it a mountain - whichever.
They go even FASTER when you're asleep. And if you're lucky, you might get glimpses of them understanding things anew/better, called Dreams that you remember in the morning.
You'll also get their Memos 'handed to you' in the mornings (or any time that day, depending on your individual timeclock).
Ideally, then, if you're FEELING it's all too much, you need to sleep longer and harder than normal for a while, to let them do the heavier lifting FOR you. (In actual fact, it's ALWAYS been mostly their job.) (That's why you get told it'll all feel better in the morning. Yes, because it got processed while Conscious You was asleep thus unable to keep putting its unwanted oar in, LOL.) However, extra sleep is not YET possible, I imagine, because...
...In the mix is: YOU'RE DESPERATELY IMPATIENT TO SEE IT DONE SO THAT YOU CAN COME TO CERTAIN CONCLUSIONS AND CEASE BEING TORN (Cognitively Dissonised...one of the most horrid mental states known to man).
...EQUALS... Well, put it this way, I'm surprised you've the brainpower available right now to be remembering to put your knickers on before leaving the house, let alone to think and type in such an organised way.
Or - you - MORE than fine, actually. This will be the making of you.
But because you don't know all this, you're panicking (common stuff) that you're nearing a breakdown. Nope. One, it's the sensation of your mind expanding and, two, your (well-oiled) cogs and levers in that already giant machine of yours are pumping and revolving so incredibly rapidly, compared to normal, it feels as if they're not connected and might all take flight in every direction.
Oh, but they ARE connected. They can't come unattached, 'they' can only make you want to sleep all the time.
This is "their moment", what they were born for...and why it's such a crime that most humans use SO LITTLE of their 'engine's' capacity. Of course, an easier route to becoming enlightened by a considerable degree is to read Dicky Dawkin's "The God Delusion" and Darwin's "On The Origin Of The Species" (and I'd like to add The Tenth Dimension by Michu Kaku - String Theory). But less points in one go.
You're JUST feeling how it would feel if, for the first time in his life, Schumacher had just this week swapped his toddler Trundle-Truck for an F1 McClaren/or whatever and "floored it". Haha! Unhinged, my arse.
Stop worrying. Worrying can DOUBLE the horrid sensation. And you've no reason TO worry, so it's POINTLESS, so ....- You can stop! :-)
Incidentally but noteably - it was nice to meet your still-inner 13-year-old....I'M UNHINGED!!! I DIDN'T ASK TO BE BORN!!! Lol
I know...Shit, isn't it, LOL. Listen, drop the delusional myth: we're not HERE to have fun. Fun is just for re-charging before getting back on with the work. We're here to LEARN.
If you 'don't believe me' - HERE TO LEARN (but with regular R&R breaks)...................HERE TO HAVE FUN. Which would you - or anyone! - hand-on-heart say is the truer match to your experiences of being alive day-in-day-out so far?
I rest me case, m'lud.
So that's that bit.
Female Cousin (best looking of the bunch) was Princess & Fire Engine."
(Narc: it's not about how it feels, it's about how it looks on the outside) (WRONG)
"She looked good but when she talked or worse still cried her voice was like the siren switched on as the truck headed to a fire."
HAHAHAHA! Commisserations, Your Ears. Myself, I had a friend at school who, kid you not, sounded more like a parrot than her own pet parrot! If either one of them talked when I had my back to them or was on my way out of the room....well, you can imagine! (If ONLY her name had been Polly!)
(Hey - quick temp check - did you MEAN to be witty jus then?)
"My Sister (Grans favourite) he'd sing lines of a popular olden day song! He called her Lulu & Sal."
Yup, Grandad's favourite. Favourite VICTIM. golden Child gets it the worst.
"The song was 'Don't bring LuLu' by the Andrew Sisters'. Hullabaloo loo, don't bring Lulu,
I'll bring her myself! F*ck me (sorry for the french but for the first time in my life I just googled all the lyrics. I only knew the few
lines he especially chose & gave his twist on. I am now crying & disturbed. Gran had clear issues. Gran was lusting after my Sister:( OMG"
Maybe when I know you better (LOL), but -
If you're crying, you're becoming UN-disturbed. Crying is a release of tension (toxins), not a start of one. (...Well, if you let it run out when it wants to.) Even though I don't know the song I do know what to expect.
Narcs LOVE using songs for their nefarious agendas, including and especially, when they want to Hoover you. ( - What - Cat got your tongue or your dialling finger dropped off? Can't be bothered to record your OWN feelings? Or is that because you couldn't POSSIBLY replicate finer feelings towards me THAT DON'T EXIST, ya tw*t.) (...which in French means, you silly billy, you).
PS I popped a wickle asterwisk in for oo. LOL That, apparently, is all it takes to make it acceptable! And don't apologise. I think we can safely say you have special dispensation on that score. Plus, what I'm more interested in, was getting to hear the lioness roar again - "Gimmie an L" / "L", "Gimmie an I" /"I.......yayyyyy!"
Anyway...So it's common for songs to be misused and abused like that (they abuse EVERYTHING) - THIS case, as a Sociopathicic Reveal, which is made to self-spark what's called "Duper's Delight" (go google), and a pre-set, future re-traumatiser (if it got played on the radio a lot back then?). I'll have a surf now... PS. And I'll bet the bstd even often played/sang it in front of your unwitting mother. But let's go look...
Ok. So what does that song and those lyrics mean to you. Were they indeed a Duping Delight? And does your sister have Red hair? :
"Lulu has the reddest hair, auburn here and henna there
How can we boys keep our heads?
Bulls go wild when they see red"
Hold onto "WAS". From now, it all gets better..all gets healed. It wasn't you kids' fault - any of it. Not even the after-effects all these years. YOU, a small kid, were threatened seriously by not one, but TWO grown, hairy, lumberjacks, into self-censorship AND told it was-fact!, nothing...and that was ALL the data you were given or had access to. Here's what you were guilty of: NOT being Mystic Meg with her crystal ball. Can you live with that? LOL
Now is just the debrief talks followed or mingled with the peace talks. It really is all good. Not least because you are all going to be going BACK - TOGETHER - to the very spot on the path right before you siblings all, to whatever respective degrees (or fashions), got Triangulated and Alienated from one another... as is the Narcissistic Family's wont.
And well done to you. The way you gave your daughter the floor and played rapt audience and conceded her points were extremely emotionally mature and daughter-respectful of you. That you did that, will have sown a giant, positive seed inside her ALREADY.
(Changed me mind.... not SAS Officer - Barrister into Magistrate... Or BOTH?)
Here you go. Not QUITE correct because in fact, it's the taking of the risk (think Flasher in raincoat, flashing) that generates the most Delight. Getting found out is a consequence - they don't give a shite for thinking that far ahead. If they GET found out - yes, they'll get it then too. But being found out is not what they're trying to achieve, just the risky teasing...the crowing behind the victim and his/her entourage's back.
E.g. take a look at what I've posted on SunnyClimes' thread in response to her past Spathic cheater's "truth-wrapped-up-in-a-lie" claim that he was going FISHING again (...and I've just realised another one: with his MATES...as in, MATING! Good god - I'd best tell her.). That's a Spath Reveal into Duper's Delight, prime example. It just means, "I-knoww some-thingg yooooou doooonnn't, naah nah-nah naaah-naaah (because they're arrested (seething) kids inside that adult suit, which is why it shows around anything to do with FEELINGS rather than intellectualisms, i.e. they could still do a job - if they bothered to turn up, of course, but you get my point). So...
Sorry, got interrupted for a while there. You're probably asleep now, though.
No, you're not going too fast for me - just don't go too fast for you. Be prepared to take a few days off (if you work), OR go to bed much earlier. You might find it comforting as well as easier to fall asleep to pop music or chat radio, played very quietly (the night gets quieter, the later it gets, so the louder it will seem, otherwise, and you don't want it waking you up at 3am). It'll keep your mind from wandering and the presenter's voice(s) will be comforting.
I do have to go to bed in a tick, though, as I've got stuff to do tomorrow, but I'll just continue tomorrow. Er...today, I mean.
"I honestly believed that was common place & generally accepted by all."
Yup. You and millions of others of targets/victims who got born into that household and culture. That's part of the whole aim of a Gaslighter or group of, and/or plus any of their oft just innocent, well-meaning but clueless (blinkered) Flying Monkeys. It's like they spike everyone's water so that they're the only sober one and get to be in-charge (without having to qualify for the job).
"We got given labels. Each & every one of us (by Gran) from 'Lazy Turd' given to my daughter to 'Brain dead desert head' my proud title amongst many more added along the way over the years."
They know to hurt you the most by accusing you of somethings however-much OPPOSITE of what you're like, and/or of qualities/traits you find particularly unpalatable in others and take pains to always stay away from. They know it gets a rise out of you. It's true, they're perpetually bored.
Your poor granddad when he was little...what a pitifully deformed and crippled creature he got pummelled into. Out-Of-Order...not only didn't work right but sparked everywhere...a fire hazard, as well as 'someone' with the Reverse Midas Touch. And look how he did the same to Uncle as ended HIM up (down) there too.
And that's the frustrating thing. Who do you blame? Grandad?....Great Grandparent(s)?.............Pontius Pilot?.................Ug and Og?
These creatures are the product of when a society is allowed to stay unhealthy for too long and becomes sick...and even then, those charged with the job fail to lift a finger............And We Are Here, suddenly all living in a pretty-much global dystopia that we used to see only on the big screen. Complacency. Formed in the run-up and during the extra-long grass of capitalism gone greedy and especially the 80s boom.
"Once again I thought this was a tactic by my elder whom I loved & respected to get me to work on myself more & improve the way people perceive me. I never considered it damaging."
Yah, like just because HE found you (and everyone and everything) irritating, that meant the whole world would. What was he - Bagpuss? What a crock. It was just him creating his own excuse to himself and everyone, to get to bully scott-free. Bullying is like their bloody Paracetamol for a perpetually recurring headache..migraine.
But, yes, I know. You and millions of others. Google NVS - narcissistic victim syndrome - and CPTSD - COMPLEX post-traumatic stress disorder.
PS: find an opportune moment to remind your daughter that you didn't have internet in those days - and it was clinical information so wasn't available all the way over in the local library, either.
We were mushrooms...Kept in the dark and fed shit-is that the time?
We didn't have the LANGUAGE.
Or would she like to explain String Theory to you - I mean, can't she see it - serously?
Also remind her that not so long ago, most humans believed the world was flat and you could get into serious trouble from suggesting otherwise.
So - "come ONNNN", herself. What's the point in berating you for not having been taught a foreign language when the WHOLE POINT of kids is they're supposed to be our Automatic Upgrade (think iPhones) so they're SUPPOSED to know a lot more by their age than we did at their age.
For someone who reckons she's so clued-up, she ain't half being thick there. No - sorry, not thick. IGNORANT.
Well, you both now have that in-common, don't you.
Again - NOT Mystic Meg. Nor Nostradumus. Nor Superwoman (girl). Nor Einstein. She can't expect a little girl to have got in a car without ever having had any lessons nor ever seen a car before, and legs too short to reach the pedals, and a torso too short to see out of the windscreen, etc., and start driving like a pro. That's just magical thinking. Well, put it this way - not unless when SHE was 13 you told her to leave school, travel to Microsoft, throw Bill Gates off the board, and take over his job PLUS make a go of it and not suffer any losses of profit? Or maybe when she was five, demand she make a full Roast Chicken dinner - without oven gloves.
Bloody kids, LOL. Think they know it all. But, look, that bit's normal, meaning, now it's your turn to enlighten HER...at an opportune, appropriate moment, obvs.
"I'm so going through something very close to (if not) a meltdown."
Epiphany, actually. Again - GOOD medicine...just doesn't taste nice....but the permanent cure is the point so it's worth it.
"I'm typing this about Gran feeling guilty because I adored the man & clearly still do."
Kids love unconditionally. Keeping in favour with one's providers is vital when you're a kid. It's not a choice, it's an in-built natural-narcissistic mechanism for the sake of survival. One's genes are the entities that make you do that (including the microchrondrial DNA).
You need to read Kevin Peltzer's book, A Child Called It.
" I'm typing this feeling so awful about the things I said about my own daughter. I LOVE HER! Make no
mistake but she's grown into a personality I find really difficult. WE don't mesh:("
That's okay. That's just how Cold Turkey and De-Toxing feels.
Well, I could tell that. Plus, you couldn't NOT love her even if you tried. You're programmed too. Unless you (or your personality) were insane. Which you're not. So you accepted what your authority figures said: it was the drink, it was nothing...followed by actions that contradicted them but not wholly.
ALSO - for your daughters info: 'getting with the programme' - one as ucked-up and terrible as that - is like expecting to awaken from a decades-long coma and immediately jumping out of the bed like nothing's happened.
"There is not a single person alive in this World at the moment whom I could say 'gets me'."
What am I - chopped liver?
"I feel like the worse possible version of myself. I'm bad mouthing everybody. I'm so unhappy. I hate people.
I hate life. I hate the World. Mums neighbour & good friend died this morning & all I could think was how lucky she is that
it is all over. "
Been there, felt that. But you mustn't take it any more seriously than if you had bad constipation and were stuck on the loo all day in some serious pain and discomfort. No pain, no gain. You might get snappy in that situation as well. Chillax some, this is just how an important process feels.
You had physical growing-pains. Did you freak out then? Well, these are merely the psych version but what are growing/getting stretched at an alarming rate are not the bones and muscles in your, say, limbs, but in your mind.
You won't feel like that for very long. In fact, the more you let those feelings infuse through you, the faster will come the point where they dissolve.
Stuff that - too vague a way to put it. You were deprived for too long of Bran Flakes, had no idea about fibre, got seriously constipated, took Movicol, now are sat on the loo doing a giant poo and it feels like childbirth out of your bumhole. YES - EFFING OW, OWWW, OWWWW, SHOOT ME, SOMEONE, AAAGH, OWWWWWW, MAKE IT STOP!!!!.... Stop shouting, do your childbirth breathing exercises (this is psych version), because yelling tenses your abdominal muscles which confines your intestinal tract, which is the opposite of what you want to do.
You didn't DO - you were DONE to. And that carried symptoms so - see your bad-mouthing as the bad gas as precedes finally needing the loo.
You won't die, you won't self-combust, you'll be alright. Because you're programmed to be and you're now on the Repairs conveyor-belt, so you haven't any choice anyway...do you want to make it harder and longer by kicking and screaming all the way there or what?
That gas belongs in its makers face. Gran. Dare to put it there or you'll be dragging out the pain again.
Let's try this:
Bad Day Gran
Good Day Gran.
You loved (had to love, but could because he was pleasant) Good Day Gran. HE was alright. So we'll leave him alone.
Tell me honestly how you feel about and towards Bad Day Gran. Have a right royal go at him. Tell him what you think of him (with asterisks).
And then do "Uncle God". (Dog, more like.)
"I am honestly emotionally drained. Physically falling apart (with health issues). I'm 54 and feel 104. I've crammed a lot into
my life but sadly most of it was bad. I know there were good times. I can resight them BUT it doesn't help when the pressures
get on top of me. I crack. I swear & carry on. I wish I didn't."
Ah. A pretty standard life, then. But hey - FATE DID JUMP IN, DIDN'T IT...because SISTER cracked and set the can of worms finally free to wriggle out....and so now things are changing, starting with you ALL feeling bad and guilty in your own individual ways for your own individual (misguided) reasons, for this and that power to affect which you none of you even had.
****Re Gran: You loved what you were given to love and ordered to love and which kept you safe/alive. Kids get what they're given.*****
"I'm not just disappointed in my Sister, Family, Life. I'm major disappointed with myself. I want to be a nicer person. I long
to be happy but everything is on top of me. I'm feeling pressure, weight etc."
I don't think Nicer is the word because you don't sound Not Very Nice as it is. But nobody is at their BEST when in chronic pain.
You're beating yourself up for having had your drink spiked, daily, with Rohipnol by someone who may as well have been the highest Mafia boss out - the effects of which were very long lasting. Plus you're not exactly the ONLY one not being quite herself, are you. What about your sister - and just now, your daughter (I'll give HER "come on").
But actually, I won't. Because she's just venting and getting stuff out of her system. She's constipated too - you all are.
"Sorry all i'm being a sooky pain in the butt while others have real problems. I've tried to be patient waiting for responses.
Don't wish to take away from others. They deserve & need time to. I'm not unreasonable. A bit selfish & needy. I should be
above these rants."
Real problems? Others? Huh?
Aw, shaddap, talking nonsense. I'm just not organised enough because I've emigrated during Covid, since which, non-stop crap won't stop for long enough to get ahead...I'm running full-pelt nowadays just to stand still, plus there's something now wrong with my email so - again - I can't see any alerts again, so I just missed the fact you'd posted, then my window closed, and it was back to dealing with yet MORE things going kaput around here. It's just up and down, as am I with it, but not spotting your response in my harriedness didn't help. My life has been increasingly Hellish since Covid (even before, actually). But then so has everyone's. Nothing is simple any more. It's like the world's roof has finally caved in, thanks to neglect. (Whinge-whinge, LOL) It was not remotely personal nor witting neglect, and it won't happen again because I'm keeping this browser open 24-7 now, instead. Unless I get yet another ruddy power-cut, of course....and too many other things n stuff, grumble-grumble.
It's like I've landed in a partly third-world country, actually. No, actually, like I've flown to Mars. I'm no longer organised, efficient, or timely or anything. This is environmental abuse. Nature getting her own back...pinging back after having been stretched back...too far. BOINGGG.....SLAP! - "OW!".
Oh, and also google Stockholm Syndrome.
I'll continue tomorrow. Night!
And, yes - absolutely correct.
She was/is/will remain your sister - without the hood (now he's dead and that fact has finally sunk in with her) and the effects on her behaviour of the hood.
See what you did there? Or a wise, 'still' part of you, anyway?
Those were your genes talking. They've been here before. They know how this plays out. Sister (without the hood).
You'd do well to study up on emotions and how they work and why - again, even Thirst is one - so that they no longer freak you out so much because you're not taking them so seriously, as if they're gospel, and so that you'll understand that, sometimes, they are just a byproductive design fault. They're very ancient and clonky still. We've sped ahead as a specie, faster than our legs can carry us.
Don't always believe what you feel or the size of those emotions, just because you project thoughts onto them - if that makes sense. Even if you and daughter got on great and you'd been as nicely self-contained as pie - YOU WOULD STILL BE FEELING THESE FEELINGS and this intensely.
Thank you so very much for your time & attention Soulmate. I'll get back in a few days. Health issues & tests to be done. Taking priority. Sis has attempted contact within 6 seconds of seeing me on FB. I exited out. Not ready to back down nor play nice. I hope she is well & happy. I know she will be wanting me to listen to her again about her 'everything'. Not this time! I've been used & abused enough!
OH I just realised that sounded both self pity & bitchy.
I don't mean to be.
Usually I jump when she gives instructions on 'how high'.
Daughter is being argumentative.
Manic Mother has phoned (all about herself) 3 times the day her friend passed.
Twice the next day.
It is ALWAYS about Mums feelings. No interest in us or our lives. Very similar to Sis.
They don't know about my health issues or my struggles.
Take ZERO interest.
I realised today after hanging up from Manic Mummy that she hasn't been there for me.
I had food, clothing, nice roof. I did not feel loved. I felt like a burden. I was reminded daily how I
had my Fathers evil blood running through my veins. She doesn't! Stipulated.
I don't want to be there for them all anymore.
I use to help clean the Grandparents house & do odd jobs for them also visit regularly because they'd get lonely & a bit down.
I constantly take Mums Manic Calls & Sis theatrical calls.
Who the fuck is there for me? You are! Thank you I am super grateful!
Daughter isn't fussed on the Mum the fates gave her. She says the family & me are just 'Too full on. I'm too intense for her!'.
So it is later in my evening & here I am (yet again talking to myself) & that is ok. No matter. That way I can't get into
any trouble. I'm starting to wonder if there is something seriously wrong with me.
Or perhaps a curse is on me.
Peace &/or happiness is something I honestly believe I will never experience or know. It feels too late.
My health is going down hill & frankly I don't give a dam.
Just gone yet another round with the daughter. Another night of hearing everything that is wrong with me & how everybody
else is always right. On the law of averages can't I be in the right at least once? PLEASE!
This life I'm living is Soul Destroying. I don't have anybody! PERIOD. Nobody. It is why I'm on here repeatedly.
I'm lost & alone. Shunned. Called names. Wild accusations. GUILTY, GUILTY, GUILTY!!!
No trial just hung.
I wish she'd move out. Never thought I'd confess to that. If alone nobody can lecture me on my mental issues. Blame me
for everything wrong in their life. Tell me I'm this, that or whatever.
IF I'M EVERYTHING HORRID THEN FOR FUCK SAKE LEAVE! STOP USING ME FOR YOUR CHORES. UNFAIR! Unpaid slave. Servant. Dickhead.
The words for my tomb stone.
I don't want this life anymore! Hopefully, those tests will come back with a disease that will end this hell that is life
as a mere mortal on planet Earth. Nice place. Shame about the people.
Yes this is a feel sorry for myself session. Who the hell else is going to?
When did somebody last make me dinner? Wash my clothes. Care what I had to say. Take an interest. Listen until their ears bleed.
I'm genuinely sick to death of my own daughter & her constant issues/dramas. Does it ever end? When the fuck will she grow up?
She has HEAPS OF UNASKED FOR ADVICE to heap upon me. Yet I open my mouth to get absolutely desecrated.
Tonight I got told 'do me a favour...instead of talking to your fake Therapist about my Aunty & Me how's about you focus on the
I just don't fit! Not with this family. Not with anybody. There must be something wrong with me. If enough people yell it at you
then surely it is true. I don't seem to think like other people. I don't reason like other people. I've been told my perception is
off. Whatever that means.
I think my only hope of friends is a rubber room, white walls & people with special coats. As daughter said 'do me a favour either get hit
by a bus or have a lobotomy'.
I'm not going to waste any more of your time.
At this point nothing can help.
Nobody can help me.
I'm too low.
Don't worry about my recovery.
Nothing can fix me.
Soulmate you can't cure me.
I'd need a whole life do over.
Nobody can provide that.
It's your thread, if you want to get your anger out, feel free and pick whatever style you like...that's one of the points of it. Better out than in - imperatively.
What health issue, if you don't mind my asking - and have you heard of the book The Body Keeps The Score?
I'm betting it's an inflammatory one....that's another target/victim woe and why Narcs are called "the gift that keeps on giving", whether they've bogged-off or passed-on. The effects ease as you recover.
So...your mother sounds somewhat narcissistic too? Me, me, me and take-take-take and you're there, going, "Can you actually see or hear me - hello?". Explains nicely, why sister treats you as if you're Mum. (Does your Mum as well?)
Suggest you take the phone off the hook, log-out from your social media, perhaps a good idea to send an APB text telling everyone you're not going to be available to communicate via any media for a few days - doctor's orders. White lie, helps you, hurts no-one. Recommend sitting doing nothing whenever you can, except for listening to classical music. It keeps your logical hemisphere dominant, which gives your emotional hemisphere (the one that's giving you grief right now) a nap, meaning, you'll background process more smoothly (like, mum gets to sit with a cuppa while baby has a nap upstairs).
But, basically, it suonds as if you've been trained into feeling you have to pay your mum and your sister a "fee" for your relationship(ish) with them, in the form of being a brick wall, yeah? Put a marker on that because you'll be able to change that when the time comes (pretty easy if you slide it in slowly and smoothly).
Daughter being argumentative. Yeah, it's her job. Emotionally, she's probably a bit delayed and these are latent teenage strops and tantrums. Like I say - let her get them out and gone. But don't let her be a hypocrite - on the one hand, lecturing you at not being as Abusiveness-aware as her, and the next, doing exactly that to you (even constant, negative haranguing is abuse).
But wait - they DON'T KNOW? Or they do but don't 'ask after'? Which?
Why don't you just have a damn good cry? I can tell you need one? I can practically hear the strain in your throat as you type. I mean, yes, it's good to vent, even in typing format, and obviously you can carry on doing that, but NOT if what you're doing is emptying your emotional bucket only a trickle at a time when you could just tip it out in-one? What are you holding back for, anyway? If you're worried you'll lose your will to rant everything out - you won't. But it'll hurt less as you do so, as well as stop you directing that anger at yourself under the guise of self-pity just because you've had to bar your mum and sister from your senses for a few days.
Try and have a cry.
Manic Mum - haha. And Barmy Blister?
But never mind that because I want to show you something (your progress in-motion, right in front of your eyes):
"I realised today after hanging up from Manic Mummy that she hasn't been there for me."
That's a whole heap of filing RIGHT THERE!
No, she hasn't. Gosh, we wonder why or whom was responsible. Same for sister. Both women mostly out for the count - and your daughter secretly resentful for things non-directly connected and which affected her, growing up. Do you suppose with this giant mystery forever weighing on and spinning around your mind, felt by you or not, that per, haps you weren't suitably involved or suitably engaged with her, maybe not fully in attendance...bit absent minded?
A burden, yeah. Constant irritant...nuisance. Yeah. All victims are made to feel like that. But it's the narcissist's problem, not yours. You can NOT take seriously an opinon of theirs because - they don't HAVE opinions. They just feel bad recurrently so grab whatever to-hand to blame. And if the blaming gets a rise or has an effect, it gets kept as a warped tool because, remember, their emotional regulation is still stuck in kiddie-style ("I hhhhate you!"). Bloody EVERYTHING irritates them. But actually, nothing does. The irritation is all in their head. It has LITERALLY nothing to do with you - unless it's however-much down to Pathological Envy of you, of course. I mean, it'sn obvious you're so much more resilient and mentally muscley than them because - look - even as young as 13 - first attempt and you growled him off. THEY didn't...CLEARLY. I mean - CLEARLY.
Me-Me-Me. The Injured Animal goes Me-Me-Me (Ow-Ow-Ow) Me-Me-Me. Think, stubbed your toe badly...hopping around the room. If someone is so insensitive as to start trying to converse with you at this point, they're going to get sworn at because they can SEE you've stubbed your toe.
You just can't see that they've badly stubbed their big toe. So it's not even irritation nor anything to do with you. It's the fact that their ego has too much trouble or finds it's outright impossible to make that OW - and HELP ME - 'public'. They'd rather put on a massive front (benignss, I'm talking...maligs are obvs another matter). They take their moodies out on whomever is closest to them AND most tolerant, understanding and empathetic.
Anyway - good. Make the buggers wait. Tell em, Sod off, I'm trying to re-stablize and you're interfering with my Chi (or do I mean cuppa Cha?).
They're not worth exhausting yourself for. No-one is, not even your daughter. On planes it's called Own Oxygen Mask First and is purely logical, Captain, whereas NOT doing it is too thick for words.
Talking of words. Selfishness is healthy. Over-Selfishness or Under-selfishness are not.
You need to be selfish for a few days (or however long you bloody like - you're the boss of you, not them).
It's not possible to be typing all alone on here. People in your boat, but whom are too shy or nervous to post, will be reading along each time.
Right, then, if you're not fit to defend yourself - I'm going to.
1. I fail to see how YOU could be the one who has your evil father's blood in your veins (genes, actually, unless they're Elizabethan throw-backs?) when ALL I - AND EVERYBODY ELSE HERE, LET'S NOT FORGET - SEE, is THEM...AND ONLY THEM - sister; mother; daughter... behaving neglectfully and poisonously. Pretty much constantly, going by your report-backs.
2. Interestink. Your daughter REALLY doesn't want you having anyone on your team right now, does she. Probably worried about my knowing how she's treating you lately and what I'll advise you in response. (She'd never guess, anyway - I'm too unconventional for her tiny brain.)
I mean - Controller, much? And what's it like, being telepathic and the font of all knowledge?
She wants bitchy? Some of us can be bitchy AND tell it like it is. (Stand back, please.)
3. Tell her to mind her own business while the grown-ups are talking, or go to her room. If she's going to behave like a stroppy, spiteful, jumped-up teenager then she'll get treated like one.
4. Tell her also to google Narcissistic Victim Isolation and do the Math after taking a long, hard look at herself, lately (at HER age, good grief).
5. And that I said, if she doesn't like it - Tough Titty. You wouldn't need it, were it not, amongst others, for her. So in fact, the power to make this stop is all hers, isn't it. DUUUUUH?
6. And - I'm not an expert on Fake anything, unlike her, according to her just now, so I wouldn't know. By this, I of course mean, her faking argumentum ad hominem (attempted character assassination to her) - for your 'benefit' - of someone and something she knows NOTHING about, nor is QUALIFIED to know a thing about, proven emperically via her disgusting behaviour, all in an endeavour to keep you without support so that she can DOMINATE you. And PS: Tell her, in real life I'm Bugs Bunny.
7. What about acting her age, rather than her shoe-size? Is she an "expert" on that, too or are her eyes fixed permanently only in one position (closed)? Here, I thought she was supposed to be one of the great enlightened?
8. And - UUUUUUGH. BLEUGH.
9. Whomever it was, flushed her Barbie down the loo - it wasn't me.
10. Or maybe she just needs to borrow one of your Feminax.
11. I can go up another level, if she'd like? Not sure someone of her calibre could make it up there, however.
12. Yeah, we can all be bitchy like the self-appointed Queen of the school playground, can't we. It's not hard. Far more effort involved in being a dignified grown-up who knows what a daughter is never supposed to sound like. She's reminding me of the YouTube dad who yells at his toddler "Î'VE TOWLJLA NOT TO F*CKIN SWEAR!". What's she trying to prove by treating and speaking to you like that?
13. ...More to the point, what does she think she's trying to achieve?
14. Who died and made HER boss? Maybe NOT a rhetorical question (things that make you go, Hmm...).
15. Oh, wait - and that I said to you: BLOODY NORA - I SEE WHAT YOU MEAN!
16. Oh, and "THANKS FOR PUTTING YOURSELF ON MY RADAR, I'VE NOW GOT MY EYE ON YOU, VIOLET-ELIZABETH".
17. Lastly but not leastly, that I said: UH-BOOJIE-BOOJIE-BOOOOOO, DERE-DERE, SHE'J JUSHT A TIRED TEDDYYY, AWWWWW. (Bit of MediSed will sort her out.)
Better yet, just say those things in your head and, in real life, look at her blankly like your ears suddenly don't work, before turning and ambling off (like you can't be bothered and it's not worth your energy), any and every time she starts trying to be verbally abusive towards her own mother (oh, yes, Little Miss New-Age Hypocrite...I say, that's not very GenZ, is it.). I call it going floppy on the supermarket floor. If she doesn't keep getting choccie bars out of your machine every time she tries to put fake 10 pences in its slot, she will pretty soon cease that futile act, called, attempting to isolate, corner, then bully.
You don't have to lift a finger to stand up for yourself, if you don't have the energy. Used rightfully, for legitimate reasons, Passive-Aggression is perfect for such situations, i.e. when they leave you no other choice. It's MIS-use of a tool that's the problem, not the tool itself (and guns don't kill, because they don't have beating hearts, arms and trigger fingers with which to pull themselves).
How does she know you're on here, anyway? I hope you're deleting your history each go?
NOTE: Bullies rely on your silence, your politeness, AND YOUR EXHAUSTION. It's called Kicking You When You're Down.
Hang on a min...She doesn't live with you, does she?
Pssst! I actually don't give a sh*t WHAT she thinks, and I suggest if that's the kind of acidic Word Salad she's going to come out with, that you try doing the same.
Bullies, whatever their age, cannot bully you unless you let them. And this is why you need to RELEASE that anger like air from a balloon (bang!) instead of letting it out in minute amounts whereby it sounds like an over-prolonged whine.
Now say it with me: "YOU f*ck-off, you f*ck-off, you f*ck-off...oh, and YOU!"
It is no good having a few psychopathic traits - the good and healthy ones - whereby as a kid you can outfox a narcissistic, highly aggressive, incestuous, paedophile, rapist if you're not going to use them ever again when you need them. You need to start standing up for yourself, PARTICULARLY when it comes to your own BABY, for god's sake. (That's what HAPPENS when you keep letting the puppy sit on your chest.) You need to cease being so afraid of releasing that sassy 13-year-old again. She was FAB! ASTOUNDING! And nobody's victim.
I'm not reprimanding you, I'm advising what you need to start to do, once you've got your breath back.
Did you give your daughter far too much power, responsibility or privilege when she hit secondary school? Is that where this has come from - her thinking she's YOUR mother? Or was she constantly subjected to watching your sister and mother get away with it during her impressionable years? Where has it come from?
I know YOU'RE not a bully. Otherwise you wouldn't be taking it out on yourself, like you're doing constantly on here. And there's the difference between nice, decent, healthy people in pain, and- oh, just gimmie the gun. LOL
Yup, she sounds pretty toxic, alright. If she isn't, she's doing one hell of an impression.
I'll tell you what's 'wrong with you':
I've just heard it YET AGAIN for myself.
Yes, you are cursed. The curse is the family legacy of mental ill-health (which, seemingly, only you escaped unscathed from!), which infects everyone around them behaviourally.
Haha, that was just fun, actually...I haven't had a bitching match for YEARS.
I've changed my mind: 'tell her' I said: CHEERS FOR THAT! :-)
Your mum WAS there for you, though. When she kept you out of your granddad's reach following that night. Correct?
So she's there for the big stuff?
PS: Teenage fun and games aside - if it's not that she's snooping: don't discuss our business with a real-life third party, please. Unless it's someone genuinely supportive of you. You can SEE it achieves nothing, certainly at this early point.
PS: Let me be clear, though.
Well done for the self-defense and assertions you've made with your feet (e.g. immediately signing-off FB) - no-one can take those Gold Stars away from you. But you're missing the other half of that skill, called your mouth (although, really, your brain).
That's why I want you to "release the hounds" and limber up on here.
You'll then have TWO tools in your toolbelt for "in case": failing to even acknowledge, let alone rise to the bait + a really sharp tongue.
You have no right to choose (oh, yes, *choose*...it is purely a choice that each child makes) to grow up a nice person if you're going to leave that person defenseless on enemy territory. Because that (drum roll) is abusive.
So don't YOU start on you or I'll have to sort YOU out 'n all!
"I don't want to be there for them all anymore."
I'm not surprised. It's like giving all your fish to a bunch of sharks. You're never going to get a thank-you. Just keep getting your arm bitten off.
" use to help clean the Grandparents house & do odd jobs for them also visit regularly because they'd get lonely & a bit down."
Almost all Empath victims do that sort of thing.
"I constantly take Mums Manic Calls & Sis theatrical calls."
"Who the fuck is there for me? You are! Thank you I am super grateful!"
Why should you have to be super-grateful? I'm just normal (in buh-der-buh-der-buh-that way, anyway). If you'd grown up in a normal family, you'd just be appreciative. Because it would be more your normal. You don't have to be grateful for normality. See what I'm saying?
"Daughter isn't fussed on the Mum the fates gave her. She says the family & me are just 'Too full on. I'm too intense for her!'."
Did you name her Hypocrisy?
Having nobody is a symptom of your being quite a ways on the Recovery Path. It's better that way. Eiffel Tower, remember? It doesn't last, though.
You're stiil panicking, though.
"To know the road ahead, ask those coming back" - ancient Chinese proverb (probably Confucius)
That path still has my fag-butts strewn all along it, LOL.
Now start having a bit of faith and doing as you're told. :-P
What do you MEAN, wish SHEEEEEE'D move out?
What are you - the lodger?
Tell her to behave herself from now on or she can pack her bags. HER CHOICE! She may be your Numero Uno but, actually, you and your health come first! If she doesn't like that, she can complain to Mother Nature and leave you out of it.
"I'm not going to waste any more of your time."
You'd have to have already wasted it before you could waste any more of it, wouldn't you? And isn't that MY decision, Control-Freak Number Five-Hundred-And-Sixty-Five-Million?
"At this point nothing can help."
Oh, I didn't KNOW you were an expert too?
"Nobody can help me."
Really? Do you have his number?
"I'm too low."
It's called Knackered from too many sheets (and not enough sh*ts) (lol).
"Don't worry about my recovery."
Oh, I'm not!
"Nothing can fix me."
Well, don't go out and buy that, then, definitely not!
"Soulmate you can't cure me."
How do you know? Who said I even needed to? What, you think Ug and Og had to have had a course with a therapist after they narrowly escaped that sabre-tooth tiger, for the rest of us to exist today? Maybe they just chewed on a bit of Bison and let Nature take its course?
"I'd need a whole life do over."
Well, that's lucky because that's exactly what you're being conveyor-belted along towards.
"Nobody can provide that."
Him again!...cuh. What's so special about him!
" Nice place. Shame about the people."
Shame about the Narcs.
I'll let you into a secret: Healthy people find the smell of even the tiniest remnant of residual Slime, too pongy to hang out with.
That's why you have to get it off you. So that you'll smell Healthy and the Healthy, NICE, HELPFUL, GIVING people like you (or what am I - still chopped liver?) find you sweet smelling, stop to chat, ask for your number...voila.
It really does work like that.
"IF I'M EVERYTHING HORRID THEN FOR FUCK SAKE LEAVE!"
They can't. They daren't. You're the only toilet for miles.
Narcs need their victims WAY more than the victims need them. They don't need the Narcs at all.
Narcs ultimately bully you to remove your legs for one reason and one reason alone: so that you can't ever LEAVE them. (Or ask them to move out.)
"Never thought I'd confess to that."
Gosh! You're doing a LOT of things, lately, that you've never done before, aren't you?
How on EARTH did that HAPPEN?
Life's a bleedin` mystery, ain't it?
(Shall I stop there or can I keep crowing=, pmsl)
...Well, since you were thirteen, anyway.
Serious post, now, and no messing (my endeavours to try to make you laugh - to see if you even could - have clearly fallen flat, anyway).
I had one daughter & she hates me 90% of the time.
She is mean spirited.
She is selfish.
She is a user.
She tells lies.
She is everything I don't respect. Frustration turned to absolute disappointment a number of years back. I realise it was all for nothing.
The time, the effort,
the devotion, the help, the listening until your ears bleed,
the being used & abused.
Helping with her problems while there was nobody there for me.
When I had her the Grandmother said 'oh the joy of Motherhood!'. What f*cking joy? Where is the joy?
It has been 31 years!
I've nothing left to give of myself. I'm worn ragged. Old before my time. The journey has been too hard, too long, too filled with pot holes & very rocky roads.
I kept waiting for her to grow up. Mature.
Get on with her own life.
IT NEVER HAPPENED!
I find her a demanding,
Not a 31 year old independent woman.
She always sides with anybody against me.
She has NEVER had my back.
I feel I'm here only to be a slave to her 24/7.
I've had no life of my own & it is her fault.
Her needs & wants always out did mine. I always had to cave.
I WANT TO BE FREE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! As a single Mum solo parent I waited for it. I've longed for it. Now I believe it will never happen.
She refuses to grow up. Kidult.
I was more responsible, independent, mature at 10 years of age than she is now. Honestly
As daughter said, 'DO Me A FAVOUR, EITHER GET HIT BY A BUS OR HAVE A LOBOTOMY'
I'm genuinely sick to death of my own daughter & her constant issues/dramas.
Does it ever end?
When the f*ck will she grow up?
I don't want to be there for them all anymore.
I wish she'd move out.
IF I'M EVERYTHING HORRID THEN FOR FUCK SAKE LEAVE!
STOP USING ME FOR YOUR CHORES. UNFAIR!
When you're ready to come back on again, I'd like you and I to have a CALM, purely factual conversation about the true degree and frequency per week (or day?) of your daughter's bad to shockingly nasty behaviour towards you. It's difficult to tell while you're letting off steam so much, how much of it is exaggerated through venting and how much you're deadly serious about in terms of its degree and weight.
I need the straight facts.
Because looking at that (above), it would indeed appear that this GROWN WOMAN, with whom you're 'held captive' - purely through the fact she lives in your house (and always has) - is more than just verbally abusive towards you.
It appears she's treating your house like a hotel, and you like the hotel chef, chambermaid, laundry-maid(?) and much more besides, I'm sure.
QUESTION: BUT WHY, IF SHE'S A GROWN WOMAN?
You're correct that this - taken at face-value - is exploitation and, given how she makes you feel hated, using.
QUESTION: DOES SHE EVEN PAY RENT? DOES SHE REALLY NOT PULL HER WEIGHT AROUND THE HOUSE AT ALL?
Whenever I'm reading about her, I keep picturing a 17-19-year-old girl and am finding it literally too difficult to keep hold of the memory that she is in fact THIRTY-ONE.
E.g., that bit where you said about how you listen to her problems and issues, beyond the point where you want to or can bear, while there's no-one to listen to yours - I seriously found myself about to answer: Well, as a mother you're not supposed to lean on your child, despite you are supposed to support her...and then I remembered - she's NOT some hormonal teenager or in her very early 20s. Far from it.
So, yes, there *should* be reciprocation but by the sounds, there's none.
Aside from the verbal abuse and lack of return-emotional support -
QUESTION: DOESN'T THIS ALSO ALL SPELL *PARASITE*?
And yet, it's your house so you would be well within rights to ask her to find her own accommodation at her own expense...like a 31-yr-old.
At the very least you could warn her that if she doesn't cease treating and speaking to you so disrespectfully, inconsiderately and unkindly...if she doesn't shape out she will have to ship out.
PUT IT IN A LETTER SO THAT THERE CAN BE NO BACKCHAT AND DIVERTING YOU OFF OF YOUR TOPIC OR POINT. You can add at the end of the letter that she can ask to discuss its contents but - one raised voice and the discussion is over and she has broken its stipulation already, meaning, TWO MONTHS' NOTICE.
I presume she works? If not, she'll have to apply for welfare.
But what you cannot, cannot continue with - and nor could anyone - is an abuser in your home who doesn't even have any right to be there.
You cannot put up with it - it's badly affecting your health - you don't have to put up with it - you WILL NOT put up with it, ANY MORE.
QUESTION: WHAT ARE YOUR MEDICAL CONDITIONS?
Currently, you sound as if she has all the power and say so... "When will SHE...Why won't SHE..."
QUESTION: WHY DO YOU TALK LIKE YOU CAN DO NOTHING AND IT'S ALL DAUGHTER'S DECISION TO LEAVE YOU BE OR MOVE OUT? Is it because she does pay rent and you need it? If so - what about replacing her with a lodger?
But anyway, this thread needs some calm and structure now. So from now on, if you need to vent, that's still fine, but please type VENTING at the top, and keep those posts totally separate from your actual conversations with me, wherein I'd like calm and straight facts, as well as you to answer every one of my questions.
PS: Something confused me, meant to ask at the time. And this relates to your 'sister' again.
Post 15 Oct 16:10:
"She took 3yr old & bolted. Little girl suffered deeply the loss of not seeing her daddy anymore. "
QUESTION: If she bolted with her, which suggests distance and cut contact - how do you know she's not seen her father ever since, and that she's been suffering?
Also: "Her adult children all lived overseas a Doc & a Lawyer (well done folks)."
QUESTION: What do you mean, well done? How do you know those now-grown kids aren't long-term miserable, for whatever reason(s), even unconnected to their family raising or brilliant careers?
QUESTION: are you in America or England?
PPS: It doesn't sound as if meds and counselling will do much for your brother because these sick attitudes of his, particularly towards women (definitely narcissistic), which basically made his marriage untenable for his wife and family, are obviously deep-seated Beliefs. It would take MANY YEARS to de- and re-programme him of such tripe, and even then, succeess wouldn't be anywhere near guaranteed. (The meds no doubt keep his anger under better control, however. Unless he just has giant Narc Fleas, including his addiction (gambling) (and rages)? I don't know but...watch that space, I suppose.)
And your sister is definitely dangerous. Yes, morally corrupt - which is why.
QUESTION: Why have you made no mention of your daughter's father? Can you, please?
Anyway, the upshot is, this whole situation is crazy-making...your deteriorating health is already a sign that it's doing you some serious damage...so you and I need to talk about you going ZERO CONTACT with your entire family (hive of narcissists and out-of-order co-victims) and for a decent period of time.
They not only do NOTHING POSITIVE for you, and everything negative and damaging.
MEANWHILE, you need at the very least go what's called, GREY ROCK.
I know of no other solution to a situaton as severe as this. You're being abused and narcissistically abused from all quarters - GANG abuse...against one individual. Including - if you hadn't noticed - STALKING.
If you've had your doctor's appointment already - make another. I want you to tell him everything that's is going on and has gone on. You need to increase your efforts at getting help in RL, despite I'm happy to support you emotionally and de-virus these people's warped input and feedback.
PS: If I had to choose one word to describe your daughter's attitude toward you MOST of the time (albeit that I'm waiting for calm, clinical verification), it would be this. Which is all too characteristic, anyway, given that, YES - then why won't she LEAVE...
Watch this video by a victim-survivor of a live-in narcissist (which means the information in her tone of voice, as well as what she says, should feel comforting for you) - which is just to familiarise yourself more with what they're like and remind you that there is life after the narcissist - plural, in your case:
PS: Grey Rock or No Contact will be a giant litmus test for your daughter, it'll force her to get real (if she can) and SHOW she is. Or not. But you need to know inequivocally where you stand with her, now and going forward (or not).
10 Tactics to Put a Narcissist In Their Place (and they respond to Comments): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h7a0HjVlD7g
10 Things Narcsissists Think You Owe Them: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fs0UVtvfjYE
Narcissist, Psychopath or Sociopath - How To Spot the Differences: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6dv8zJiggBs
(This one is a tiny bit out-of-date IMO, because new research lately in, shows that, as with anything, it's always been a mixture between Nature and Nurture, but she's correct in terms of PREDOMINANCE. Also, psychopathic traits are bad only in large doses (in fact, we all have an inner psycho if pushed too far for our particular breaking point), meaning, you can get "good psychopaths - the Pro-Social". However, you don't tend to get good Sociopaths. Furthermore, other experts have shown that psychopaths CAN have empathy but have the ability to CHOOSE whether to allow themselves to feel it for whomever at any given time. The fact is, very few experts agree on a lot of things, because research is still relatively new and ongoing...we're establishing new understandings all the time...so it's a case of keep watching that space.
Ultimately, however, it doesn't matter. All one needs to know is that they are being repeatedly, and for too-sustained a period, abused. And there, according to you, is no denying that you most certainly are.
Don't let them frighten you, either. It is NOT the fight of your life. It is when you don't know what you're doing so make needless mistakes and wrong moves as makes it messy and drawn-out. THEN it is. We're going to avoid that.
And this. It's about what it's mostly like to be you in that whole family CULT of 'yours'. The Scapegoat.
Your sister was the scapegoat but 'rolled over' (broke) and joined the cult (probably because no-one who should have rescued her from that "ultimate abuse" (sexual) situation as had her child's mind concluding, well, if THEY'RE allowed to behave like that and nothing happens - and I can't STOP them being like that - why should I be the only good one when it doesn't get me anywhere! You're the only one who's consistently resisted their thinking and ways. You're the strong one. In "Opposites Land", if (think chickens and chicks) the Runts (narcissists) vastly outnumber the Normal, Fine Specimen, they'll try to (unlike chicks - SLOWLY, drip-drip, to avoid establishable guilt and prosecution for GBH or Murder) peck him/her, either down to their level (where s/he unwittingly ceases to pose constantly as their superior) or to death :
Accompanying, more succinct (but less personal) article. I would advise you READ THIS BEFORE watching the video (which is not merely a repeat of the article):
The toxic family operates like a cult. Generally one parent is the main perpetrator. They’ll be the most dominant personality usually with anger issues. They’ll use their anger outbursts to frighten family members and force them to submit to their agenda. The other parent is usually what we call the Enabler. They are weaker than the dominant parent and submissive. They perhaps rely on the dominant parent aka puppet master financially and thus are dependent. They see the abuse taking place but they numb out and turn a blind eye to it. They regularly join in with gaslighting messages to the bullied child of “Can’t you take a joke?” and “You’re way too sensitive”. They tend to blame the scapegoat child for the abuse that they’re receiving with phrases such as “You made him do it”.
Toxic families are astute and clever at putting on a very ‘normal’ face to society and any activity that takes place outside the family house. They are expert manipulators and create red herrings as to the truth of their character by being involved with the local church, fundraising, charity work and sitting on the school board for example. Nobody would suspect a thing. They cover their tracks wisely. They know that society allows this abuse take place and they therefore don’t need to fear accountability. They likely grew up in a violent home where crimes took place and the perpetrators got away scot free. They witnessed this with their own eyes.
The mental illness of these adults is not to be underestimated or played down.
They lack empathy and this makes them dangerous individuals capable of severe child abuse.
They lack consciousness and have no intention of changing their ways. Keeping the status quo is of the utmost importance.
They rally their troops around them. They train their children to abuse the scapegoat child on their behalf. This works well when they are deceased as the intergenerational trauma continues and the scapegoat is never free of a bully to take the place of the parent who started it off.
Bullying the scapegoat child is normalised. It’s just part of every day family life.
"Why wouldn’t we laugh at [name]? Did you see what she’s gone and done now? She’s really out done herself”.
“Sure we’re only having a bit of harmless fun” is how they justify the gang bullying and ostracisation of the family scapegoat.
Their childishness and callous sneering knows no end.
They become addicted to putting one family member down so they can feel superior. The siblings feel that they are bonding with their parents. They can make the parent laugh by coming up with a clever cruel line about the scapegoat - they’ll receive brownie points from the parent for this. The parent feels validated in their choice to bully their scapegoat AND they get to feel like a good parent. They are ‘close’ with their golden child.
The scapegoat must be isolated at all costs. This is why when the scapegoat starts going low contact or no contact the first point of call with the puppet master parent will be to make contact with the people closest to the scapegoat - best friends, spouse, partner etc. Now they’ll want to turn on the victim mode
“We’re so worried about him, can YOU talk some sense into him. We love and care for him so much. We’re concerned for his mental health. He always showed signs of depression, anxiety and paranoia. We just want the best for him”.
They’re so convincing it’s creepy. People lap it up and take their side. The scapegoat doesn’t stand a chance.
It’s classic old paradigm stuff.
The puppet masters intent is to keep a family trashcan to dump all their pain. If the scapegoat is not willing to be the receptacle of this pain then the scapegoat must be destroyed. At this point, they really get off on the drama of it all (it’s their addiction) and they’ll enjoy rallying around and coming up with a plan to inflict pain on the scapegoat and punish them for having the audacity to assert their basic human rights.
They’ll be offended and upset that the scapegoat sought freedom and is attempting to break away from the cult.
Reasons the siblings, family members and flying monkeys are loyal to the puppet mater (main perpetrator):
The siblings are brainwashed from birth on the narrative and it’s their survival strategy. If they don’t agree with the scary parent, THEY could be in the firing line. Standing up for the scapegoat is a big NO NO in toxic families.
One person is the problem and that’s the end of it.
People are terrified of the main perpetrator. As mentioned earlier, they generally have anger issues so an outburst of rage is never far away. They’ll throw their toys out of the pram and make life VERY difficult for everyone if they don’t get their way. This makes it easier for people to justify bullying the scapegoat - “I may as well go along with this, because it makes for an easy life for ME” they reason to themselves.
Society props up this way of thinking. What takes place within a dysfunctional family is also taking place on a bigger scale in society. There is a collective consciousness around this. Society likes to have a blind spot with it. “I know it’s happening, but I’m going to pretend it’s not happening”.
So long as the status quo is intact people can get on with life as ‘normal’.
When the scapegoat is trauma bonded with the family, they are the lynchpin that keeps everything looking good on the surface. They take a hit for the team. They put on a smile at family events and return home to suffer in silence and shame.
When the scapegoat doesn’t play ball anymore, things get hairy and fall apart at the seams.
In summary, the main perpetrator rules like a dictator. They want power and control. Nobody is allowed think differently than them. They rule by fear. They live by fear. They are mentally ill. The children they raise also suffer from mental illness due to the high levels of dysfunction they are exposed to. The children are terrified and in survival energy. After a while, this way of living is normal to them. The siblings of the scapegoat will lie to themselves and tell themselves that their parent is good and right and the scapegoat is bad and wrong. This is their identity and world view. To challenge this later in their adult life could cause a mental breakdown so their subconscious won’t allow them go there.
All roads lead to bowing down to the main perpetrator out of FEAR. It simply makes for an easier life for all concerned (apart from the scapegoat but nobody cares about the scapegoat).
"The scapegoat must be isolated at all costs. This is why when the scapegoat starts going low contact or no contact the first point of call with the puppet master parent will be to make contact with the people closest to the scapegoat - ***best friends, spouse, partner"....
"...Now they’ll want to turn on the victim mode"
Gosh, who does this sound like.
Mmm-hm. Houston we have our ringleader.
YOU TYPED: “We’re so worried about her, can YOU talk some sense into her. We love and care for her so much. We’re concerned for her mental health. She always showed signs of depression, anxiety and paranoia. We just want the best for her”.
I want to begin by sincerely Thanking You for your help Soulmate.
So much to read and mull over here.
The above QUOTE reads exactly like my life. This is the current situation. I've heard those exact words! Word for word! Mother & Sister say exactly this behind my back (not aware I overheard). Step Father joins in agreement simply by nodding. He's a weakling. I'm not quite sure whether my Daughter does or doesn't agree with them? Perhaps she agrees with their outlook during her private convos with them (which I know there has been phone calls about 'ME' or I should refer to myself the way they all do. Using 'HER' or 'THAT ONE' as I've literally heard my Mother refer to me.
Two days ago my Mother rang on my daughters phone to talk to me. Says she can never get whose mobile number belongs to who correct.
I see my daughter nodding. As if Mother can see her agreement to what? Paranoia tells me it is about me. They don't realise (the dickheads) that when Mother has 'speaker' switched up to high volume due to her age & hearing well it literally bounces off the walls in our small apartment. Her words to my daughter.
Example: 'Hello, how are you? Are you alright? How are things with that one? You know what I mean. Is SHE alright. Are things 'ok?'. How's the mood before you pass me over to her? Is she in one of those types? You know what I mean Love. How are you coping with HER? The dark Cancerian we all have to accept. How are things there really? The mood swings? Now tell me before you give HER the phone.
I take the mobile & get a different voice, a different tone, a different person to what I've just overheard. She thinks I know none of it. What goes on behind my back.
I feel isolated. I feel like an Island. The one person I use to pin all my hopes & dreams on...my daughter...has crossed over to the other side.
I'm desperately depressed, I am sad & never felt more alone.
NEW TOPIC! VENTING.
In answer to another one of your questions: Daughters Father
I married young. Fools errand. Thought I loved him & all that shit. Got excited about nothing then married it. He was 3 years older than me yet
3 years less mature. We had been together 6 years before we married. Then were married for about 2 years. So 8yrs in total.
Anyways, he was a little boy who couldn't grow up. Peter Pan! Didn't want responsibility at all. Wouldn't mow the lawn. Did nothing to help me around the house (that has been my life...a slave to others). He did sports all the time & spent all the money all the time. Leaving me at home.
I recall when I told him I was pregnant with great clarity. I came out of the Docs surgery (he didn't accompany me in but sat in the car in the carpark listening to the radio) and I said 'guess what? You're going to be a Father'. The silence which followed was deafening! He turned the radio off & stared straight ahead hands gripping the steering wheel. I asked 'did you hear me? I just told you how you are going to be a Dad in February'. He said 'yep I heard you' then he started the engine & began driving for home. TOTAL SILENCE! I was inwardly devastated. This didn't go like any movie I'd ever seen! I was 22yrs old.
When we got home he did not utter a word to me. He went out on to our balcony & shut the door behind him (something he never did! I noted how I'd been blocked out). I put the kettle on & gave him 5 mins or so to absorb the news. I presumed he was in shock. Soon I opened the door & joined him on the balcony. 'what are you doing? what is wrong? I just told you that you're going to be a Father'. He responded with 'yes and I just saw myself in the car driving straight ahead full speed into a brick wall'.
Should have realised what was ahead for me at that point but I was young & stupid. Still a dreamer. Long story sorry. She was sick. A LOT! Allergic to life itself practically. Doctors & specialists non stop. Hospitalised at about 6 months old. One afternoon after work he said
'I'm leaving'. Just like that. Out of the blue. I said 'what? why? where did this come from? we are married. we have a baby. What about her? Talk to me I don't understand'. He responded with 'this is it now...my life...her sick all the time, money & appointments on my days off work. I don't want this. It isn't for me.' He began packing at that very moment. He drove away. Didn't think he meant it. Thought he'd come back. I had to move from there as he left me penniless. I was a stay at home Mum as she was sick all the time. I couldn't cover the rent. He left me with it all! ALONE!
I moved into Govt Housing with rent assistance with baby girl. We coped as best we could. I was walking the floors with her sick. High Temps, Projectile vomiting, the runs constantly. More Specialists. Fun times. When she was 1.5 years I got served papers for Custody of her. I had to go to Court. The first time he didn't show up.
A number of months later he did it again...served papers to try & take her from me. Wanted Custody? My Lawyer found out it was actually his Mother paying for a Lawyer & trying to get my daughter for him? He was still disinterested in her. How do I know? My Lawyer arranged Mediation Sessions? Twice he didn't show up. My Lawyer arranged a hearing over custody to sort it all out.
He turned up late to Court where we were all already in there. He had no Lawyer was representing himself. Judge had a go at him for being tardy. Judge had a go at him for his dress sense & he said 'oh sorry I'm in beach gear because when this is done me & my mates are going to the Coast'. Judge asked him what he was hoping for from these proceedings. He said 'I don't know. Guess I'll see her sometimes'. Meaning our daughter. Judge asked him her date of birth. He couldn't remember. Judge asked him her age. He couldn't remember. Judge asked him her favourite toy...he didn't know.
Judge asked him do you want full custody? He said 'no. my Mother arranged those papers'. Judge said how often would you like to visit and have overnight access with your daughter? He responded with 'oh I don't need her over night. I guess if I could see her for a couple of hours once a month then that would do.
Judge said Court recommends more interaction so she could get to know him. Judge stated how he was thinking access for every week end Friday through to return her Sunday evening. He said 'no that is too often for me. I do sports on the weekends. How's about a few hours once a month' he told the Judge. It went on.
Judge gave me 'Full Custody & full decision making rights'. He got granted access once a fortnight supervised by me for 3 hours initially with a schedule to increase over time as she didn't know him at all. He never showed! A year later he/his mother put me through it all again. This time the Court ordered him to attend the visitation.
First time he turned up to my new residence & switched the TV on watching sports. He stayed about 1 hour. She was ignored completely!
Second time he turned up & tried conning on to me for sex (which I refused) & then opened my fridge ate food & made himself a coffee. She was ignored completely! She fell asleep & so I asked him to leave. As he left he said 'would you make me your famous caramel tart for my birthday next time I visit?' I saw red. I threw any projectile I could find at him & told him to get out! I chased him out. Throwing shoes, photo frames, ornaments, anything I could get my hands on I hurled at him all the way down the front stairs to the car literally. He fell down the last three steps. I was delighted. He ran away from me like a frightened dog. I even took off the shoes I was wearing on my feet & hurled them at his car window as he quickly wound it up. He drove off.
Six months later I was served papers yet again. This time with a twist. As I'd moved into another better rental house (2 blocks away from the previous one) he declared to the Court how I'd 'absconded with his daughter & was unable to be located for the past half year'. They held a hearing to arrange a new access regime'. It gave him the right to take her once a fortnight for the week ends.
HE NEVER SHOWED UP!
A year later they took me to Court again to try & get custody claiming me an 'unfit Mother'. The Court found it laughable! He was given a new access regime! He took her (their first time alone together EVER) to the local park down the road from me. She said he climbed a tree (leaving her on the ground alone she was 3 years old) and he told her to go hide & I'll seek you. I'm a monkey. She said 'she sat on a swing by herself and waited for him to come down'. He was allocated these 3 hours alone with her for them to BOND. This was his very first unsupervised visit & she didn't
remember him at all! She didn't want to go with the stranger. At home I watched the clock, pacing. He returned her to me after an hour. He declared her 'difficult & refused to play'.
HE NEVER CAME BACK AGAIN TO SEE HER AFTER THAT DAY! EVER! No phone calls, No Birthdays, no Christmas, no Easter, no School Functions, no Gifts, no NOTHING EVER!
We've been alone just the two of us ever since. She is now 31 years old.
Unless it's that you hadn't finished responding but had to break off for whatever reason? -
I'm waiting for you to answer all of my "QUESTION"s as per my post Oct 19 at 14:47 before I can move on to your latest.
And please note I need purely factual answers - no commentary whatsoever in and amongst it regarding your feelings or opinions (that's venting). Make like a reporter writing a newspaper article.
Also, next time, please keep venting and factual accounts completely separate, not in the one, same post like you've just done.
You also labelled the factual stuff as Venting. It's obviously the other way round.
Do you suppose you need to slow down and take a breath? Maybe take a few days off, like you suggested?
Sorry for everything I am apparently doing wrong here.
Thought I was on a friendly chat forum?
Feels more like I'm on approval.
This message makes a grown adult feel like a school child not doing their homework correctly.
Can't seem to do anything right here?
I clearly don't meet with your approval.
I apologise for stressing you Soulmate.
Sorry that you find me so irritating.
Is there no other person to respond to forum chats?
Careful you are sounding full of yourself.
Qualifications? If any?
Your only answer to anything & everything is 'Narcissist'.
Right. Now your turn:
Dear FivePetalPromise, I mean, Transmutation/Shadowperson, I mean, Anne-Marie,.... (Gosh, who DO I mean? There have been so many of "you"),
Thanks for the unexpected-expected tantrum and game of Mask peek-a-boo.
I knew if I just said nothing, thereby leaving you dissatisfied, and bided my time "you'd" pop up again. But, as I prefer not to leave loose ends, I'll reply to your (er) last "your"s latest, anyway. And then we're done.
"Sorry for everything I am apparently doing wrong here."
I doubt that, but "thanks, I guess?" ;-)
It's called, refusing to cooperate to even the most basic level, like normal visitors (an assertion of Equality on my part as contradicted your assumption of Power Over on yours). Oh, and repeatedly trying to pass yourself off as a genuine poster, of course. But my request certainly didn't warrant your character flinging "herself" onto the proverbial floor in the foetal position, switching disturbingly too rapidly back-and-forth between spitting the dummy and acting all melodramatically betrayed and broken-hearted, any more than the last time and the time before... Bit of a giveaway, even if I hadn't already spotted you by then.
Is that what you were like whenever your mother asked you to, for example, do her the courtesy of pushing your chair back in before leaving the dinner-table?
Here, maybe write about carpets and all other flooring? You must be an expert on those by now? And you know what they say about successful authors, writing only about their first-hand experiences?
"Thought I was on a friendly chat forum?"
Nooo, you didnnnnnnnn't. Probably because it's too obvious that's not what we are - one giant clue being the fact of our having a visibly separate Chatroom facility..., still. (FYI, those two swivelly things either side of your face...)
More like, because Your Royal Highness simply decided you wanted it to be, so that was that.
I should hasten to add that the Chatroom is Moderated too.
"Feels more like I'm on approval."
Um... Don't get that, I'm afraid, so... no comment.
"This message makes a grown adult feel like a school child not doing their homework correctly."
A grown adult?
"Can't seem to do anything right here?"
Oh, no - I asked you to cooperate with me for a change! How utterly distressing for you, Alexis. I'll call Blake!
"I clearly don't meet with your approval."
Nor do ANY Trolls and time-wasters of public resources meant to help genuine advice-seekers.
And due to the fact I can spot you every time and yet your arrogance and over-estimation continues, unchecked and unabated, which means, you refuse to learn (because you're not here to learn).
Any time you feel cornered by a salient question of mine as threatens your exposure as a Victim-story-telling troll (- attempted), you immediately spit the dummy, blame it on something perfectly innocuous and interactionally commonplace on my part while attempting to discredit, when you and I both know it's my refusal, yet again (SUCH a crap servant), to let you keep total, despotic control and domination over the narrative and proceedings, before abandoning thread for a new one.
So tiresome. We have zero tolerance on here for that sort of childish nonsense.
"I apologise for stressing you Soulmate."
No need. You didn't. I'm not that fragile. Kind does NOT automatically equate to Weak. Well, maybe in your world.
"Sorry that you find me so irritating."
Refer to above,prior answer to said same projection.
I wouldn't mind if the faker could pay attention to Continuity and Realism, including how they themselves behave (like a genuine victim...albeit, I concede one would have to have ever BEEN one to do that), whereby the thread at least could be useful to genuine victims as some sort of hypothetical case-study. But you seem incapable of putting the effort in, despite it's one of the ways I catch you out each time.
"Is there no other person to respond to forum chats?"
Even if mere chats WERE appropriate on the forum as a main purpose - not since, no. )Life's a bleedin' mystery, ain't it?)
"Careful you are sounding full of yourself."
Really? Oh, no!
Wait - Why, what will happen if I indicate ownership of my lifelong, indepth experiences and studying? Will my leg fall off? Or, worse - I'll set some ever-unreasonably, ever-envious and resentful individual's teeth on-edge?
"Qualifications? If any?"
Yes. Proper grown-up for a start.
My turn (I know...still a crap slave): What's your home address? If any?
"Your only answer to anything & everything is 'Narcissist'."
Hahahaha! Now THAT, ACTUALLY, was genuinely funny! Probably because your only *question* to anything and everything is 'Narcissist'. LOL - I realise it was unintentional, but - nice one, I enjoyed that.
Hey, maybe you should try comedy playwriting instead? As one who adores a laugh, I'd probably be up for that?
Notwithstanding, don't feel too bad for your inability to 'get one over' on here, nor take it too personally. I'm just hyper-patterns-aware, that's all, and this, you should hopefully have now finally gathered, isn't your bog-standard forum. Plus, to be fair, I've never really been into fiction, more fact.
What can I say? Try another forum? Unless secretly, you enjoy banging your head against a brick wall?
Meanwhile, on here as 'over there'...